Warning light is on alert and the alarmbell is ringing!!!
By kimthedane
@kimthedane (945)
Denmark
October 27, 2007 11:47am CST
HORRAY, we are having a referendum in Denmark on Tuesday November 13th our minister of state announced the other day and I am so delighted :) Finally we get the chance to get rid of a government who thinks more about the European Union, globalisation, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and profit making business than they do of their own people. Does this sound familiar to you Americans?
However this is not the subject of this discussion. Our political system in Denmark is a democracy containing a multiple political party parliament. Usually with 3 parties on the left (democrats & socialist parties) and 3 parties on the right (conservatives), a few in the middle or the extreme outside left/right. Usually we have a government from either left or right who depend on one of the other parties to have the majority. Atm we have a conservative government who is supported by the extreme rights. A government who i selling our welfare for bloody business and money and who is very hostile to anybody in need, especially refugees and people on social.
As I am exited and happy about this election I was watching a political broadcast last night on the television. A handful of politicians have broken out of their original party (5 different) and created this new party supported by some big guns in the international business. One of those big guns, which appeared to be one of their top candidates, turned out to not being able to speak Danish properly. I really had to concentrate to work out what he was saying. As I was watching on i realised in horror that this man was also Muslim.
Now here is the subject of this discussion:
The official religion in Denmark lies in Christianity or Catholics, but most Danes i believe are atheist's and never see a church from the inside. But over the past 20-30 years and due to globalisation, different conflicts or catastrophe's around the world, plus the fact that we needed the labourer from eastern Europe in the happy 60's, we now have a population of close to a million who is either of a different origin or 1 generation of what we call New Danish, who for most parts are Muslims. Denmark have a population of about 6 million all together.
I think the world, especially my little world, has gone all crazy. The Danes all move abroad to work or live and we have people from all over coming to our country to work and live. Now one thing is that we all have to adapt to the circumstances, whether we like it or not. But at least I think a politician should keep his faith to himself and not make it public and at least if you stand in a national parliamentary election, the least one could expect that you are capable of speaking the language of that country.
What do you think? Am I too harsh or critical? The vision of the Muslim faith is to be, not only the dominating faith but the only religion in the entire world. They have changed our society now they go for our parliament. The warning light is on amber and the alarmbell is getting louder. :)
2 responses
@Lindalinda (4111)
• Canada
27 Oct 07
Hi Kim,
I am a little bit confused here. You mention a referendum. Usually a referendum is about an issue, i.e. whether or not to accept the Euro, or wanting to join the common market. Reading further into you post I now assume you are talking about a general election and you hope the ruling parties will be defeated.
Now, the other issue you raise is about "new Danes running for parliament. I don't know what the law in your country is but I know in Germany you are not automatically a German if your parents emigrated to Germany and you were born there. To be a German at least one parent has to be German at the time when you are born, or the parents would have applied and received citizenship.
I live in Canada and if you are born here you are automatically a citizen, can vote and can run for a seat in parliament. so I presume if these "new Danes" run for a seat in parliament they are citizens of Denmark.
Now you address the issue of religion. Is here is a separation between church and state in Denmark? If there is, certain groups such as Muslims cannot demand their own rights such as having the call to prayer broadcast from the mosque or going into a bank or public office with fully veiled faces. In Canada, fully veiled women cannot get a driver's licence or a passport unless the face is exposed. They can wear a head covering though. Men can not marry more than one wife, although we suspect cases of polygamy where the second wife is simply identified as a "cousin" or other relative.
In Canada the catholic religion has a certain protection enshrined in law in the BNA act. When Ontario and Quebec formed a confederation that later became our country these rights were granted. But when you pay your school taxes you can indicate public or catholic. We had a provincial election in the province of Ontario a couple of weeks ago and the Conservatives proposed to support all "faith based" schools. There was such an outcry and they did not have a chance to get elected.
Last year there was tremendous pressure to allow Sharia law in Ontario in family court. there was a big fight over this, since orthodox Jews always could settle custody and family matters by religious mediation. The difference here is that women are always favoured in this group so they never objected. The upshot of all this was that now all custody and family matters must be settled in family court without religious mediation. I applaud this.
So I think you are right religion should be a private matter and people who are running and are elected to parliament should abide by this. We have some Muslim Members of Parliament, as well as Jewish Members of Parliament and of course people of all kinds of religions so far they have not caused a problem, at least not on the federal level. Let religion rest in private life only. Accept immigrants who are willing to respect and abide by the Western culture.
1 person likes this
@kimthedane (945)
• Denmark
31 Oct 07
Hi Linda. I am sorry that I confused you, but you guessed right: I was of course talking about a general election. My fault, I even know the difference but guessed I was caught up in exitement of the subject.
Though Germany is our closest neighbour and we are both in the European Union, our rules sounds a bit closer to how you describe it in Canada. When refugees are accepted and awarded asylum in Denmark, they have the choice of applying for Danish citizenship and if they do they will get it. However regardless of whether you apply or not your kids, if born in Denmark, will automatically become Danish citizens with equal democratic right to original Danish Citizens.
About a year ago the party who will have my vote announced a new candidate. It's a woman, she's a Muslim and refuse to bow to common practices in our parliament. i.e. refuse to drop her headscarf while in parliament and wont shake hands with a man. Nobody else are allowed to wear head wear in our parliament but our Queen and this started a seriously heated debate whether she could refuse to abide by common practices. But she can as common practice is not law. Also shaking hands when you meet somebody is a very common used way of greeting others and especially is the western world, she would be seen as rude and arrogant if she cannot shake hands with for instance fellow politicians or co-partners. So already before she is voted into parliament she have mixed her religious faith with her political stands, which I see as a huge problem as by doing so she will get votes from Muslims just because she is a Muslim, but they will not care about the political message.
I can see from your post that you in Canada have to adapt to these changes in your society too, which sort of confirm my concerns. In these political correct ages you are so busy adopting and embrace other cultures and religions into your society and loose sight on the dangers of our own original cultures and religions disappearing. Nobody dares tell this Muslim candidate to abide with common practice or let be, as everybody knows that the ones doing so will be hung out for publish display and anger all over the world, especially in the Muslim world
This seriously worries me for the future of my daughter and my grandchildren to come.
@Lindalinda (4111)
• Canada
1 Nov 07
Well fortunately you live in a democratic country and if people refuse to vote for this candidate she will not gain a seat in parliament. I think we in the Western World have to be vigilant and protect the customs and common practices that we like. Myself I believe I am a tolerant person and respect all religions but I definitely believe in equal rights for men and women and in the separation of church and state, for this reason I would not vote for any candidate who would not leave their religion at home, even if it meant to vote for a party which I did not like. Recently my little granddaughter was born and sure would like her to have the same rights and freedoms for which the women in Western society have fought so hard for. Best wishes.
1 person likes this
@kimthedane (945)
• Denmark
1 Nov 07
That is what I mean Linda. My concerns do not relate as much to myself as they do to the future of my daughter and her kids when that time comes. I like to think of myself as a pretty complacent person too and do not mind other nationals, gender or religion and love going abroad to explore different cultures and foods, even don't mind enrol some cultural activities and food into daily living. But when somebody try to take over domination of my country, whether by trade, religion or war, I am sorry to say to say but then i will be very protective of my nationality and cultural heritage. Thanks for your very wise replies. :)
