Mentors, Book-learning, Intuition, and Hands-on Experience

One of the reasons that I like reading your discussions is the way you have such a knack for "opening cans of worms", so to speak. I find that I love the way you think on so many topics. But this one really does open a can of worms for me. My personal path of spirituality, practice, etc., has been about the most twisty one that one could imagine. Visualize a steep mountain road with lots of complete switchbacks, and you're pretty close to how mine has been. I was raised as a child of a Lutheran Minister, so Xianity was my first spiritual training. Around the age of 8 I began to exhibit psychic abilities, visions, and paranormal abilities. My father, even though being a Xian Minister, allowed me to follow this through and begin studying and practicing. By age 13 I was approached by a Coven of Witches to learn Olde Witchcraft (not to be confused with Wicca, two very different animals). I was Priested in Olde Witchcraft on Samhain, 1971 and HP'd a yr later. I then began getting into Eastern Mysticism and studied Buddhism (in several forms), Hinduism, Tao, etc. Even went as far as to study for the Priesthood in Buddhism. Then had a "born again" experience and became a fundamental Baptist. Felt the "call to the Ministry" and began studies for ordination as a Xian minister. Went to Bible College (graduated with a B.Th.) and was ordained as an Evangelical minister in 1980. Went on to Grad School (Seminary) and earned a Th.M. & Th.D. in Apologetics (defending the faith) and a D.D. in Pastoral Counseling. While in Bible College got involved in "Messianic Judaism" and sought to delve into training in the Jewish belief system; so I attended an Orthodox Jewish Yeshiva (Seminary for Rabbis) for 3 yrs while in Bible College. Learned Hebrew, Talmud, Torah, Rabbinical Theology & Law, etc. Became the Asst. Rabbi at the Messianic Synagogue. After Ordination as a Xian Minister I began an Apologetic/Evangelistic Association. And several yrs later moved from the L.A. area to Philly, where I became the Director and Head Counselor at The Christian Counseling Association of Philadelphia. I went from extremely "low church" fundamental Baptist, through Charismatic, to Reformed Theology, into Anglican Theology, and there to higher and higher "Churchiness", until I finally ended up becomming a Roman Catholic. Which ended my career as a Minister. The Pope has this little pblm with married priests with children. LOL. So I went into Respiratory Care. While working at a large hospital in Bethlehem, PA, I met ppl from around the world, of every possible belief system. I found ppl in each and every one of those different religions and beliefs that could only be described as ppl that walked hand in hand with god. So I began to question my own faith and took a really good look at it. Ended up becomming convinced that Modern Xianity is NOT what Jesus taught. It is actually Pauline not the teachings of Jesus. So I ended up leaving Xianity entirely and went back to Metaphysics and Hermetics and Magick. Ended up studying for Ordination in a Hermetic Organization. (Yeah, I know, there I go again. Can't do things half way, I always jump right into the deep end.) Then I discovered my American Indian blood and that set me off on another tangent, studying American Indian spirituality. Was called to study under the Medicine Ppl. and eventually became the Spiritual and Ceremonial Leader and Inipi Keeper of The People of The Morning Star. When I moved back to PA, I ended up having ppl come to me for training in Native Spirituality. So for several yrs. I taught them. Then in the later '90's a number of students came to me wanting to learn Magick, so I began teaching them as well. Eventually all this coalesced into The Ekklektic Universal Church (basically a combination of everything that I've studied throughout my life) which we are now in the process of turning into The Ecclectic Universal Community (an Intentional Spiritual Community) without all the trappigs and titles of the old Church. Along the way of this path I also delved into studying Islam, Theosophy, Aboriginal Spirituality, Asatru, and many other forms of Paganism. What has led me on this appearantly eccentric path has always been my unquenchable thirst for Truth, and my refusal to stop learning. Ok, I may get the most long winded post award for this response, but see what happens when you ask a former Preacher / Teacher a question... LOL. We don't just say a word or two, we give you our life history. :) So to answer your question, I've learned from books, teachers, mentors, practicing, formal educational settings, AND making mistakes. All the above. Sometimes the last one has often been the most valuable way of learning for me.

I learnt from my own family, initially. basic stuff, rather than the religious side. I honestly can't say where I learnt my religion. it's like I just knew it. it's like a story that I don't remember ever being told. but remember it. although my family is Pagan, the practices are taught, but not the religion. each is free to find it for themselves. so as a child I learnt Divination skills, spellcraft, and how it works, how to use energy, and about spirits. in my early teens, around that time my dad (who we no longer lived with) took an interest in Spiritualism, and joined a local group. this group used to meet at different members houses, and I often joined in, as it was at the weekends, when I used to visit. although the group had nothing much to do with Paganism, I learned a great deal from them, honing divination skills, trying new ones, like Psychometry, which I'd never tried before, learning a bit about essential oils, crystals (which I got really into at the time, and have now moved much away from as I'm not comfortable with the effect on the environment and communities where they're blasted out of the Earth.) I learned more about spirits, much more about meditation and pathworking, more on energy work, and trained as a Medium. I feel that my experience with this group really built my confidence, as they were all impressed with my "knack" and it really made me a better and more capable Witch, even though it had nothing to do with Witchcraft. then I started reading more books, getting involved in online communities, and researching other paths, other traditions, and the history of modern Paganism. I've met other Witches and Pagans, and learned a lot from them. although most I've met, it's fair to say, I know I'm a bit further along. I've still learnt from them though. you can always learn something, even from people just starting out. I don't really get involved with the wider community. in my experience, the people that tend to be heavily involved with other Pagans, beyond being friendly, and occasionally going to each other for help, tend to be shameless self publicising charlatans. it seems like nearly anyone who's worth knowing keeps to themself. unfortunately, because of the way they push themselves as pillars of the Pagan community, and founts of knowledge, it's the people playing at Grand High Poohbah that those seeking teachers tend to end up running into. and it's the blind leading the blind out there. on the occasions you go to a Pagan meet, you know it's the quiet ones watching the room that are the real deal. not the one surrounded by a circle of wide eyed newbies telling great tales of their exploits. that person is usually just an imaginative storyteller, who probably has the magical skill of a lump of rock.

I learn from the same ways you have, I borrow from all religions to find where my place in this universe is, I find truth in every form of religion though no one religion can answer all the questions

Oddly enough I started out with gut instinct when I was very very young...it was just a "feeling" if that makes sense..and i did, believed etc etc many "Paganish" things if that makes sense....Of course back then I had no idea that Paganism, Witchcraft, Wicca or any alternative path for that matter, existed...Fast forward to my 20s I met my bfs sister who at that time had been on her path for 15 yrs already..we got to talking one day and I learned that all the things I'd known, felt in my core and experienced throughout my life etc was an actual religion so to speak LOL...THATS when I started reading like a madwoman...NOW and for the past several yrs now its my instinct and experiences above anything that my personal path is based on...Sure I still read, research, learn from others via conversations etc etc and so on but life I think is the main factor at this point..more specifically, MY life if that makes sense..LOL Am I making sense..I'm only half here at the moment.

At the risk of entering a discussion which is not entirely in my sphere, I think your question can be applied to Christianity too... Some people have learned solely from reading the Bible, others solely from a Church or minister (mentor). My own approach is really combined and probably fairly typical. Originally the first thoughts are planted by mentor of some sort, whether it be a friend associate or a minister of religion. This is then followed up by study (in the Christian case of the Bible and maybe other books), and then lived out in experience whilst being fed by study and mentoring. Most Christians may also say that they feel led by the Holy Spirit along their journey and this might be equated with your intuition as although this is external. it usually manifests as intuition,instinct or conscience. Does that make sense? What I am trying to say that a balance of all these things is required, we cannot lean too much on a mentor because they are just human, study is all very well, but we benefit from insight from others (EG. those that might speak Hebrew or Greek), intuition needs to tempered by intelligence and learning and should not be followed blindly. Without all the others, hand-on experience will be poor...

Hi Lecanis, are you still around? Shamans and Elders Dreams Books Formal study Discussions with friends Prayers Meditation Dancing