Socializing Healthcare, Good or Bad?
By meepsack
@meepsack (9)
United States
June 21, 2008 12:19pm CST
Looking at both perspectives, one has to take into account the good and bad effects of having socialized healthcare. On one side of the argument you have people saying that free healthcare can reach all classes of people, resulting in health coverage state-wide for everybody free of charge! Sounds great, but only in theory. Free healthcare goes hand-in-hand with spiked taxes, waiting weeks or even months for an appointment with a doctor, receiving a poorer quality of doctors, and the possibility of these medical experts having less care concerning you. (After all, you aren't paying them)
What's your take?
3 people like this
5 responses
@LovesTravel (303)
• United States
21 Jun 08
Ask yourself whether you believe that quality healthcare is a right or a privilege. If it's the latter, then we needn't make any serious changes. That's the realm in which we currently function. But if it's a right, then national and universal healthcare is a must. In my opinioin, it's that simple.
@barehugs (8973)
• Canada
22 Jun 08
Most developed Countries world-wide have Socialised Medicine. Canada has had it since 1984. "Medicare," as it is known in Canada is not free. Taxes on most purchases, except food items go to Pay for the Plan. Socialised Medicine is accessible to every Canadian. Taxes are not spiked, but are constant, and those who spend the most, pay the most, so it is very fair to everyone. Nothing is perfect but Medicare is a very good Health Plan. Canadian Doctors are of the Highest Quality, and will stack up to the best in North America. In fact our Medical Establishment is coming up with new medical breakthroughs with great regularity. One of the Best things about our Plan is the Peace of mind that comes with it. You never have to worry that your neighbor will lose his home because of his poor health. Canadian life expectancy in 2005 was 80.1 years.
USA life expectancy in 2005 was 77.7 years.
I believe this reflects the benefits of the Canadian Health Care Plan.
@barehugs (8973)
• Canada
22 Jun 08
Please don't keep referring to our Canadian plan as "free" Health Care, Its Not free, we pay for it everyday of our Lives! And Yes we have a shortage of Doctors too, but its not critical. We wait for care too, sometimes up to two months, but more often its two weeks. Very few of our Doctors leave Canada to practise in other countries. I have American friends in the US who gamble their life savings on their health, because of the unbelievably High Insurance Costs. They tell me they want to die suddenly in a traffic accident so their kids will not be disfranchised. This situation should not exist in the 21 century. How is it that well-off Americans can stand by and see their poor neighbors die without medical intervention?
1 person likes this
@Citizen_Stuart (2016)
•
22 Jun 08
Don't do it. We've got the National Health Service in the UK, and it's been a disaster IMIO. Waiting lists can be months or even years long, it employs more administrative staff than medical staff, the nursing staff very often don't care about the patients, fraud is rife and standards of hygiene have plummeted. Nationalised industries are never efficient. Better to have a mixed system based on the private sector, health co-operatives and charities.
@LovesTravel (303)
• United States
22 Jun 08
I'm curious about your source of inforamtion because I have found the National Health Service to be far more efficient than our own. Both have problems, for sure, but our system is rife with profiteering. And because profit is often the bottom line, patients (especially uninsured patients) don't just have to wait for some services. Far too often, they die because they are literally denied the care they can't afford.
In Britain, people with life-threatening conditions are moved immediately to the top of the list. This process takes the most critical patients first, which indeed means that patients with non-critical conditions or patients seeking elective proceedures may have to wait a bit longer. I have seen this process in action, and while one would like to see shorter waits all around, it seems fair to me that more critical patients get more immediate attention. That's nothing more or less than effective triage.
Americans with good insurance policies also wait. We wait to get appointments. We are subject to appointments being changed at our physicians discretion. We wait for hospital and physicians' schedule to coincide so we can receive needed treatments. We wait in waiting rooms. We wait for insurance companies to allow or disallow tests and procedures recommended by our physicians. If you don't think waiting, fraud and corruption, profiteering, and mediocre care characterize much of the American healthcare system, then you aren't paying attention.
So for me the bottom line is: Is healthcare a right or a privilege? If it's a privilege, then don't change a thing. Let those patients who can't afford the cost of care simply die. And please let then do so QUIETLY so the rest of us are not needlessly inconvenienced. That's just the way we've chosen to do things.
But if healthcare is a right--or if it should be a right--then there has to be a national, universal healthcare system of some kind. Free enterprise proves on a daily basis that it is incapable of dealing humanely and efficiently with our broken healthcare system.
There's no reason why we American can't benefit form the lessons learned in other systems. As it stands now, we as a people have a shorter lifespan than the British, for example, and we have more stillborn babies. That tells me that on the whole, their healthcare system is likely better than ours, despite its faults.
1 person likes this
@meepsack (9)
• United States
23 Jun 08
There was one instance of a story similar to what I told on my local news channel. He was told he had about a month or two to live, but he had to wait nearly four months before he could see a surgeon, so he came down here and payed for it to be done within the week.
@spalladino (17891)
• United States
22 Jun 08
Many people don't look beyond the *promise* of free health care to the reality of what that would mean in a country the size of the United States. Let's start with a shortage of doctors. It takes upwards of 12 years to become a doctor and, unless the government is going to pay for that education and support those people while they're in school and in training, the shortage of new practicing doctors will be seen fast. This will cause even longer waits as the number of physicians in practice will not stay the same as doctors retire or switch to research where they can earn a decent living.
I feel for everyone who does not have health coverage. I have relatives who don't have any and it's a struggle when they need medical care but providing them with substandard care is not the answer. Small communities like the one I live in will have no doctors instead of the few that we have now because they will quickly become overwhelmed by the number of people trying to get appointments and will close their independent offices to work for a larger group someplace else or, again, move to research. So, in many areas the ability to receive medical care will become worse than it already is.
Imagine, too, that you have a terrible toothache and need to see a dentist. Even when I didn't have dental coverage I FOUND the money to go to the dentist if I was in PAIN. How long do you think you would have to wait if healthcare was socialized and everyone was free to fill up all the appointment slots?
What if you want elective surgery? Right now you have to pay for it yourself if your insurance doesn't cover it but, if medical care was socialized, you lose that option, too. I'm not talking about a face lift, I'm talking about gastric bypass surgery for someone who is overweight, cosmetic surgery to improve a malformation of the face or any limb, things that are important to the people who suffer from them.
You lose the option of making medical decisions for yourself which, in some cases, could be catastrophic. My husband is an example. He was receiving all of his medical care through the V.A. before we were married. He had a blockage in his carotid artery in his neck which went from 70% to 80% in one year. He had had a triple bypass five years ago and had repeatedly requested to be referred to a Cardiologist but his primary care doctor felt it was unnecessary. Since we were married and he was covered under my insurance we took him out of the V.A. for a work up by a private Cardiologist. His heart was fine but that blockage in his neck was not 80%, it was 93% and there was a good chance that he would have a stroke within six months. He had surgery to clean out that artery two weeks later...because he had the option of seeing another doctor. Had he listened to his doctor at the V.A. and waited another year to be retested, he wouldn't have walked into that appointment. So, no, I don't trust government run health care. The doctors at the V.A. care, and they do the best that they can, but they have too many patients and too little time to spend with each one. And, obviously, their testing equipment or the people reading the results are not of a very high quality.
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
22 Jun 08
The government wouldn't be running health care, I don't know where that idea originates from. You say, "You lose the option of making medical decisions for yourself which, in some cases, could be catastrophic."
Most of us have already lost that! The insurance companies make the decisions, not us or our doctors in most cases, and it usually ends up costing the insurance companies even more because they're not medical professionals and all they're thinking about is saving pennies initially even if it means wasting hundreds or thousands of dollars in the long run.
Annie
@LovesTravel (303)
• United States
22 Jun 08
I doubt that thinking people see universal healthcare as "free." Of course it wouldn't be. But our current broken system of healthcare is the most expensive (on a per capita basis) in the world. It supports a vast bureaucracy of insurance providers, hospitals, physicians, and the pharmaceutical industry. It's expensive and it's inefficient. What most of us who support universal healthcare want to see is a more inclusive, more efficient system that might also prove to be less expensive than what we curently have.
Even our Medicare system, as imperfect as it may be, is more efficient than the vast bulk of our entreprenureal, private healthcare system. What we are doing now is to provide mediocre healthcare for the masses and vast fortunes for a very few "investors" in the healthcare industry. That needs to change.
Healthcare is one area in which the old system of supply and demand just doesn't work. If it did, we would not be lagging so far behind in such a key area as life expectency. Think about it. Do you really want to coninue paying for higher profits in the healthcare industry by giving up months and years of your total lifespan? That's what we're doing now.
1 person likes this
@spalladino (17891)
• United States
22 Jun 08
Annie, this many be true in some cases but this was not our experience with BlueCross/BlueShield of Florida. We contacted a highly recommended Cardiologist who ran a battery of tests and referred us to a surgeon who performed the surgery and follow up tests. We never heard one word from BC/BS about what was done or how long my husband stayed in the ICU or in the hospital.
Whether government run or mandatory, I don't agree with forcing people to participate in these programs. I saw a story on the news about one state that has already instituted mandatory health coverage and many people can't afford to get it so now they're threatened with being fined by the state for every month they go without it. How is that fair to people who are already struggling?
1 person likes this
@mimico (3617)
• Philippines
22 Jun 08
I like the idea of a socialized system. Even though some pay more taxes, everyone benefits in the end. It's not as if you don't get superior health care when you pay more taxes anyway. Being human is also about taking care and seeing to the needs of others. I don't think God gave us life so that we can succeed, be healthy, and be happy at the expense of other people.
1 person likes this