A mans right to choose

I think if you play then you must pay. no exceptions. why force women into abortions just so you do not have to accept the 'responsibility of paying for playing?

um.... ooooK. Thats not at all what i said but thanks for the response. I am not saying that a man should be able to force the woman to abort, but in the event that he wants an abortion and she doesnt then he should be financially off the hook, in the same manner as women can physically be off the hook with an abortion(I understand that abortions come with their own set of risks.)

Of course you can't force a woman to have an abortion... I never said that. In fact I have read nothing in this discussion that resembles the endorsing of baby murder. As a point of fact I think abortion is wrong. But since its legal for a woman to have an abortion I think men deserve the right to a "financial abortion" meaning that we too deserve the right to not have an unwanted child and should be able to freely, without prosecution, disassociate ourselves from them. Women have the right to do this, why can't I?

The baby is half and half, but she is going to have to look after it for 9 months, so she should have the right to decide whether she wants to do that. A guy can run for it if he does not want to look after the child, but I woman can't do that in the first 9 months, because the baby would have to come with them.

Thanks for your opinion. I disagree. That baby is as much a part of the man as the woman and he deserves rights too. And I dont think that it should be anyones SOLE decision except in certain cases where something horrible has happened or probably will happen.

i love you

What on earth do seahorses have to do with the price of tea in china? If men could bear children and women were not capable you can count on long lines of women trying to stop men from getting an abortion... they would be argueing in the same fashion that I am only not as calmly.

Thanks for the response... The 'opt' out is actually the one I support more as well, though I do also feel that as long as the womans health is not in risk from 'the preggers' and the man is not a rapist or anything disgusting that he should have the right to keep his baby if he wants it and she does not.

I respectfully disagree, but you know that. I cannot imagine being ok with a woman "who is not in any danger from the preggers" aborting my seed(note the lack of term 'baby') if I want to keep it. Its mine too. as far as protection is concerned, yes wear a jimmy hat. but women have protection too, its not all one sided and should not be the sole responsibility of the man to get it. especially since there are 10 or more options available to a woman and just one or two(surgery) for the man. but thats a different topic;)

We obviously have differing opinions about this, that is inevitable I suppose. I of course agree that responsibility and protection is of the upmost importance on both sides. I cannot think of anything else to add that would make my point any better so I will leave it at we agree on some stuff and disagree about others. Thanks for the intelligent/well thought out discussion that you bring to the 'table'.

You make a valid point, but a court of law would have decide whether the man and woman are in a consentual, healthy relationship. That would be very difficult for a court to do because it could be hard to find sufficient evidence either way. It's basically a he-said, she-said situation.

I F*CKING LOVE YOU... I didn't think of that, but I was in an abusive relationship and daddy got deported...I did have children by him...but I know how terrifying it can be and that would definetly give a man more control...I HAVE BEEN TRYING TO TELL WHOEVER IT IS WHO POSTED THIS THAT IT'S JUST MORE CONTROL FOR MEN...BUT HE'S ON SOME OTHER SH*T THAT I GUESS I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND. EXCELLENT POINT!!!+++++

He said, She said... This is a good point, It would be very difficult to prove if the woman was being dishonest and evil. I guess I wasn't even considering the feelings of dishonest and evil women.

I know enough about having children and the economy. Yes, raising a child can be expensive and, yes, rape is extremely a wrong thing to do but in my opinion that's no reason to take the life of a child. This is why adoption services exist - for the purpose of raising children whose parents cannot/do not want to raise them themselves.

I think you don't know much about having children or the economy. Money doesn't grow on trees and contraception fails at times...I wouldn't have a child if I couldn't afford it.Women get raped all the time...and I would never carry a baby that was conceived by rape in my womb...NEVER!

Thanks for your response, I am truly a strange individual and Im ok with that. I do agree that it is wrong to kill or abandon a child, but since I believe in equal rights, and women DO have this legal right(regardless of moral objections), I do think that men should have rights too.

I've argued lond and hard about this matter. I'm pro life. But sometimes abortions simply are better for everyone affected. If humans were responsible and capable I might have another view. I definitely would have. I dislike abortion, but I wouldn't ban it.

thanks, I agree.

Well said. Thank you for your response.

Agreed.

Thanks for responding, I agree.

I agree that it is bull to not give the man the right. Sure, some men do not take responsibility that doesn't mean that all men want. It sickens me to see a woman make the decision when it's also the man's decision. The woman didn't impregnate herself, and if she did it'd be artificial insemination and then in that manner she'd want it.

I like this conversation. I've been thihnking about the matter a lot in my own little. The problem I've had going on in my own little is the fact, what should happen when the mother of the child doesn't want to have a baby, but the man does. After a night of passion a woman may get to keep a child without the man ever knowing about it. It's just biology. But in the case it would come to the attention of the father, it's pretty hard to pull a veto on the abortion. Then again it would be his baby. His flesh and blood. Surely he should have some rights. I've never seen a mother nor father taking care of a child not even a baby 24/7, there are many men I know who would be the better parent, but as mother nature has devised most mothers have their maternal instincts stonger than the father.

all men want are more rights than women so they can feed their big everything else, small p*nis syndrome

Thank you for your opinion. I disagree that the woman should have more choice in the matter, especially based on the "mothers are best" arguement. I know more than one woman who does not take care of the baby for even a year let alone till adulthood, and it is literally all up to the father. As far as pregnancy is concerned, 9 months isnt even a year so that does not convince me that you deserve more rights to choose than men.

I notice you are young...I'm young too...but I have kids...do you? Do you know what type of responsibility it is? I do it alone...daddy got deported...I WILL HAVE AN ABORTION REGARDLESS OF WHAT A MAN SAYS BECAUSE I CAN NOT FINANCIALLY AFFORD IT AND I WOULDN'T WANT MY KIDS TO LEAD A HORRIBLE LIFE WITH NO FOOD ETC.

It cannot be that way. Only women have the right to choose. I never said that a baby was a parasite or a virus, but to some woman, that baby is not wanted, and be that the case, the woman is carrying the child and thus she has the right to terminate the pregnancy if she chooses. It is not like the woman wakes up one morning and says, "I am getting rid of this baby today". She went through a range of emotions before doing it. Men have no idea how hard it is to be pregnant, how scary it is, and how many things can go wrong. Some women just cannot handle it. Now, I, personally, would never give up my child be it mine and my current boyfriend's baby. The reason being is that I love my boyfriend, and I know I would love our child as much as I love him, even if he choose to leave me, I would keep our baby, but if I was having a child by a man that I did not love or want to be with, yes, I would probably abort that child. Think of women who are raped. They do not ask to be pregnant, should they be forced to carry the child of a rapist? Never. You have to look at it from the woman's perspective. She is going through one Hell of a time when she is pregnant. Put yourself in the shoes of a woman who is going through a really hellish pregnancy and then tell me what you would say to her. I have known women who have had abortions, lost children, and who had horrible pregnancies. I put myself in their shoes and I realize why they did what they did.

I agree that some women do not care what their man thinks, in fact reading all the comments on this discussion I think that most women do not care about the mans feelings. Ok I understand that the baby is in the womans body, but its not as if its a parasite or a virus or anything, jeesh. Of course if there are medical concerns the woman has with pregnancy or child birth then the man does not have a say... This was my first new discussion and I can see that I am going to have to be way more thorough in the future, because I am getting misquoted and misunderstood from all directions. Men deserve to have a post-conception choice to be a parent or not, just like women have the right to abort and not be a parent. Thats just how I feel, equal rights and pro-choice should be two way streets.

Rapists and molesters do not deserve any rights let alone these ones... who on earth would let a rapist say a woman must keep his demented baby, I never said it and I never will. Rapists deserve to have their "junk" slammed in a drawer or car door 24 times a day for the rest of their miserable little lives.

Thats not what my point was. if a man is given the right to say you cannot have an abortion then where will it stop when a man want the woman to abort therefore forcing the woman to do something she doesn't want to do

Who said anything about forcing a woman to abort? not me.

The funny thing about equality is that its a 2 way street. a child is part the mans child and part the womans and therefore ANYTHING to do with that child should be a joint decision until the child reaches the age of 18, including prebirth.

lets not forget about tube ligation... Though I agree that vasectomy is faster and less painful, I still have my own mental issues against anyone going near my 'goods' with a scalpel, razor, knife, laser beam, or dresser drawer. I think women are better suited to visit doctors, it's practically part of their daily life. I dont even know a doctor let alone visit one regularly.

Then be a man and take the consequences of your actions. I do appreciate what you are saying about your "parts".

I agree that men should toughen up and deal with the situation. Im simply saying that the current laws are rediculously one sided, based simply on the short 9 months of pregnancy. A real man is a father for many years, just like a real woman is a mother for many(not to say that the childless cannot be real man or woman.) And im sorry but months doesn't compete with years... In my view. Maybe Im wrong, it wouldn't be the first time.

Who said anything about forcing the woman to abort? not me.

Seem as though, you did!! You said you should get to choose and if she had the baby, you should be set free. That is not right because you might be missing out on somebody special.

Scroll up and read what I said. I said that we should either be given rights equal to the female abortion or at the very least veto power over an abortion of a child you want. No part of that includes "Force that lowly woman to abort the little rat" THAT IS NOT WHAT I SAID OR INDENDED TO IMPLY!

I never said anything about forcing the woman to abort, that would be wrong. You are not the first person to put these horrible and evil words into my mouth through the course of this discussion... I never said that, and I never will... Yes many men already abandon their child, but that doesnt mean its legal to do so. These men are subject to prosecution and any lack to do so is because the woman said to herself "I don't need him"... and she probably doesn't. The simple fact of the matter is that women have a post-conception choice of whether to be a parent or not, and men are supposed to just toughen up and pay for it. This is not equality this is feminism.

Please forgive me if you thought I was putting words into your mouth. I didn't mean it like that in any way. But, I just wanted to make a point about how giving the father a choice in the matter does affect the woman. I was not suggesting that you would try to force the woman to have an abortion but other men may. When laws are made, all of these different things come into play that we must stop and look at. However, there are a few things that a man can do legally if he does wish to cut ties with the baby and mother. One thing that can be done is to have the baby adopted by someone else. Men really cannot protect themselves from having to support the children they father other than being careful from the beginning. There are many situations that can arise that are really unfair to the father. A close family member of mine wanted a relationship with the child. However, the mother did not want this. She did everything possible to make his life hell. He would cry for his child, but there was nothing he could do. He could have fought for rights to see the baby, but she was doing everything possible to destroy any means of that happening. She was determined to make his life HELL. Now, this child feels that her daddy didn't want her. He looks like the bad guy and there is nothing he can do.

Coming from a mother, I do agree with you as to giving a man a choice as to his legal rights. He should be able to say that he wants no legal or binding responsiblity. I'm not saying that I think it's right, but he should have a choice as well. And, if it's done early the mother can decide what she wants to do as far as an abortion or not. It isn't easy raising a child alone.