Palin Has Her Own "Minister" Problems - Controversial Views
@CherylsPearls (1269)
United States
September 3, 2008 1:25pm CST
Since everyone has seen and discussed Obama's minister, let's discuss Palin's. Palin's church, minister and beliefs are every bit the story that Obama's is/was. In a speech given in June, addressing the graduating class, Palin states that the war in Iraq is "a task from God."
Ed Kalnins, the minister of Palin's church - Wasilla Assembly of God - has said such things as:
[i]critics of President Bush will be banished to hell; questioned whether people who voted for Sen. John Kerry in 2004 would be accepted to heaven; charged that the 9/11 terrorist attacks and war in Iraq were part of a war "contending for your faith;" and said that Jesus "operated from that position of war mode."
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During the 2004 election season, he praised President Bush's performance during a debate with Sen. John Kerry, then offered a not-so-subtle message about his personal candidate preferences. "I'm not going tell you who to vote for, but if you vote for this particular person, I question your salvation. I'm sorry." Kalnins added: "If every Christian will vote righteously, it would be a landslide every time."
Kalnins bristled at the treatment President Bush was receiving over the federal government's handling of Hurricane Katrina. "I hate criticisms towards the President," he said, "because it's like criticisms towards the pastor -- it's almost like, it's not going to get you anywhere, you know, except for hell. That's what it'll get you."
What you see in a terrorist -- that's called the invisible enemy. There has always been an invisible enemy. What you see in Iraq, basically, is a manifestation of what's going on in this unseen world called the spirit world. ... We need to think like Jesus thinks. We are in a time and a season of war, and we need to think like that. We need to develop that instinct. We need to develop as believers the instinct that we are at war, and that war is contending for your faith. ... Jesus called us to die. You're worried about getting hurt? He's called us to die. Listen, you know we can't even follow him unless you are willing to give up your life. ... I believe that Jesus himself operated from that position of war mode. Everyone say "war mode." Now you say, wait a minute Ed, he's like the good shepherd, he's loving all the time and he's kind all the time. Oh yes he is -- but I also believe that he had a part of his thoughts that knew that he was in a war.
Kalnin's has also claimed that Palin's election as governor was the result of a prophetic call from another pastor. [i]"[He made] a prophetic declaration and then unfolds the kingdom of God, you know."
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Palin's pastor is one of those "end-time" preachers; you know the type. He says, [i]"I believe Alaska is one of the refuge states in the last days, and hundreds of thousands of people are going to come to the state to seek refuge and the church has to be ready to minister to them."
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I would love your opinions on this. Personally, "end-time" ministers are not my thing. I think most of them are quacks and nuts. I take that back, I think all of them are quacks and nuts. This one seems to be a great example.
Personally, knowing that she believes things like this scares me. It's one thing to have nuts like this holed-up in some woodsy cabin in Idaho; it's altogether another thing when they are next in line for the Presidency.
Your opinions? The link to the story is below.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/02/palins-church-may-have-sh_n_123205.html
3 people like this
12 responses
@4magoo (396)
•
3 Sep 08
Oh my gosh... that is awful. I salute you for helping to put it all together. I find it most enlightening. I don't think it will get much play in the media but if knowledge moves out in slow circles, let's hope that the time you spent putting your discussion together will bare fruit.
2 people like this
@CherylsPearls (1269)
• United States
4 Sep 08
Hi, 4magoo. I found it most enlightening as well. The press hasn't had the time to check her out, but hopefully they will. She is unknown to most of us, and I want to learn all I can about her. So far, I am not impressed.
1 person likes this
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
3 Sep 08
OMG, Cheryl, this is indeed scary stuff! All I can say is, while I'm admittedly not a church goer for years now so according to many here I'm a sinner heading to he11 anyway but I have my own personal faith and I do plenty of praying. I don't think politics has any place whatsoever in our government and certainly not in our elections and just the idea that this "man of God" would instill fear into his members that if they didn't vote for Bush and literally support him at every turn they'd go to he11 is absurd! Thanks so much for posting this!
Annie
1 person likes this
@ZephyrSun (7381)
• United States
3 Sep 08
Will you wait for me at the gates?? LOL
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@ZephyrSun (7381)
• United States
4 Sep 08
http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-09-03-palin-pastor_N.htm
1 person likes this
@WhatsHerName (2716)
• United States
5 Sep 08
Lol, you are not seriously trying to compare this church that she no longer attends to the evil racist America hating church of Rev. Wrong are you?
1 person likes this
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
3 Sep 08
*rolls eyes*
cripe, you guys will grasp at any straws won't you.
This is FAR from the absolute vile hatred spewed by Rev. Wright. As well, Rev Wright's sermons were down right hateful towards the white race. This stuff here is no different than the incredibly stupid yet harmless stuff Pat Robertson says. Wright's doctrine was one of racism backed by quiet support and nods to violent and dangerous separatists.
In addition, the pastor of which you speak, joined the church in 1999, Palin left several years later, of her own accord, not because of intense public pressure and political collateral in avoiding a scandal like another candidate was forced to, because of the pastor's way off beat views and sermons, she saw this guy was a nut and left the church.
1 person likes this
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
4 Sep 08
Do I have an article to point you to? not really, she left before she was even mayor or even city council, there would have been no real controversy to her being a member at the time she left, she would not have even been on the media radar and therefore there would be no articles on her being a member or the controversy of it. It was mentioned in several places about her past that she had left however in recent articles on the new-old controversy.
the point was, Obama may have finally left his church and for that I applaud him, but it does make one wonder, why he did, as he was in fact running for president when he did it. again, speculation? perhaps, but then so is the controversy surrounding Palin. the bottom line is she left long ago, before she was even mayor. Obama did not resign until nation wide outcries were raised.
1 person likes this
@CherylsPearls (1269)
• United States
4 Sep 08
Roll your eyes, xfahctor! This is just as valid as the beating Obama got for his church - which, by the way, I gave him myself.
Sure Rev. Wright's sermons were vile and hateful. I don't see how you think these are not just as vile and hateful. The things that Pat Robertson and yes, Billy Graham and all the others have said are not harmless. How do you know that Palin's minister is not racist, too? You can put what everyone knows about her in a teaspoon! Please do tell me where you found out that Palin left the church because "she saw this guy was a nut?" I certainly didn't find any evidence of that. If you have it, I'd love the link, please.
I'm not grasping at anything. I'm doing my best to find out who she really is and not just swallow the fluff offered up by McCain's people.
So, if it was fair to Obama to scrutinize his church, then it's fair to Palin. Period.
1 person likes this
@ZephyrSun (7381)
• United States
4 Sep 08
I was a little confused by your post X, but she didn't leave that church until 2002 and I thought her major position was before that.
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@collieluv28 (388)
• United States
4 Sep 08
This is some really interesting stuff. I read the entire article on the Huffington Post & found it fascinating. It will be illuminating to read more about Palin in the weeks to come. A friend of mine who is a staunch Republican thinks that the election is over & it goes to Obama. I think that one can never underestimate the Repub. party. I think this new information is worthy of discussion much as the revelation of Obama & Wright. So what if Palin left before she was elected Gov of Alaska. She stayed for quite some time & one wonders how the minister shaped Palin's beliefs. I admit I am a liberal Democrat who will vote for Obama in November without reservation. All that McCain & Palin stand for goes against everything I believe in. Cut taxes for the rich? Stay the course in Iraq? Do nothing for the environment? Pro big oil? No thanks - I'm looking for the change & leadership that Obama/Biden offer. Thanks for this info, Cheryl & a great discussion.
@CherylsPearls (1269)
• United States
4 Sep 08
Thanks, collieluv. I'm glad that some people did find it enlightening and interesting and not just throw it off like it means nothing. I never think the election is sewn up! Not until that last vote has been counted! Of course, I am a liberal Democrat, too, so we haven't seen "our own kind" elected in a while now! I'm looking forward to it, though!
1 person likes this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
3 Sep 08
First off, your source makes me take this story with a large grain of salt. However, assuming that they are accurate,
The only statement of Palin's belief is that the war in Iraq is a task from God. Is that what scares you? That she believes bringing democracy to the world is a God-given task of the biggest, most successful democracy of all time? I understand that when political officials of any party bring religion into issues of policy it makes people nervous. It should. Separation of church and state is a major cornerstone of this country. But, you can only separate church and state in organizations. Divorcing people from their faith in God would make them much weaker leaders. If Palin's only support for going into Iraq is because it is a God-given task, then there's an argument. But, I have a suspicion that there are a host of other reasons for her support. Reasons that are grounded in foreign policy and defesne of the United States.
As for her pastor, has Palin acknowledged this man as her "spiritual guide?" Did he bring her to Jesus? Did he marry her and her husband? Many people attend churches in this country and do not agree with everything coming out of the pastor's mouth. How close is Palin to this pastor? Before we start putting his words in her mouth, why not find out if they are as close as Obama and Reverend Wright were? Her pastor's statements may or may not reflect her beliefs.
@CherylsPearls (1269)
• United States
4 Sep 08
I was sure someone would "doubt" the source, but then, how many times have conservatives piped up from sources more far out there than Huffington?
Yes, it does scare me that she may think she is on a mission from God. Her type of religion, to me, is no better than the one that demands that terrorists kill all of us "unbelievers." Now, I am not for a minute saying that the mainstream Muslim religion believes that; I am saying that Palins church/religion is just as radical and outrageous as those who kill in the name of Allah.
I don't know if Palin thinks of him as her "spiritual guide"; I don't know if he "brought her to Jesus"; I don't know any of that for certain. The reason that I don't know it is because I haven't had over a year to listen to her and to find out these things. Or anything, for that matter. John McCain made sure of that.
I'm just raising the question and asking for opinions. But I'll be looking for the answers as fast as I can.
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
4 Sep 08
Accordingly, I did some research and found out as stated below that Palin left the church in 2002. Six years ago. She now declares herself a nondenominational Christian.
Thus, attributing the pastor's beliefs to Palin would seem a reach.
As to your point about not having a year to get to know her, you're right. She has only been governing the state of Alaska, rather than campaigning for president.
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
4 Sep 08
I went to their website and it made me very uncomfortable; especially in listing what they believe:
http://wasillaag.org/index.php?s=au&nid=3734
Since the Huffington Post is not a mainstream newsource and I don't want to be accused of not practicing what I preach, I pulled this article from USA Today:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/2008-09-04-3023525078_x.htm
According to this article, she only attended the Assemblies of God Church until 2002. Although I do feel that she probably holds these radical views, I don't KNOW that and I will give the benefit of the doubt, although I wouldn't vote for her. Her viewpoints differ too greatly from my own.
For the record, though, I will agree that Pastor Kalnins is a nutjob, but the Assemblies of God Churches are famous for creating nutjobs. Various members of these churches like to bomb abortion clinics in their spare time. That's not saying that all of them do so, but I've never heard a single one of them condemn it.
1 person likes this
@suspenseful (40192)
• Canada
3 Sep 08
I see nothing wrong with her views. At least her preacher is not like Obama's in saying he hates white people. I do not know if Palin's nomination was a prophetic call, but it could be that God allowed her to be chosen and is telling us that when man fails to do his part, a woman will have to be chosen.
I do not know when the end will happen and maybe Alaska will be a refuge. But often prophecies are not magic, they happen because the people allow them to happen so if Alaska becomes a pro=life state, where people believe in God (after all most of the Alaskans are Roman Catholic) and stand for traditional family values, what is wrong with that? The only thing is that I believe that God chooses people to enter HIS KINGDOM and people do not choose HIM, and I believe in infant not adult baptism. So I hope Mrs. Palin comes around to that view of thinking.
@CherylsPearls (1269)
• United States
4 Sep 08
You don't have to see anything wrong with her views; I asked for opinions, not agreement.
You said that "most of the Alaskans are Roman Catholic;" is that something you know or something you just think? lol Just curious, really, because from what I know, Alaska has some of every religion just like every where else.
Thanks for your comments.
@morethanamolehill (1586)
• United States
4 Sep 08
I don't understand, If Obama's Pastor,Mentor,who married him and baptized his children, Can stand in the pulpit and belt out in his best pastorvoice for God to DAMN AMERICA!! for it's treatment of black people, Then saunter off to his Million dollar McMansion in a "white" neighborhood, and you don't have a problem with that, then what is your problem with Palin's pastor that she left 6 years ago?
This subject doesn't even live up to my screen name.
@CherylsPearls (1269)
• United States
4 Sep 08
Maybe you should have actually read the information on the website. No, her pastor didn't say "GD America." Her pastor says basically that if you voted for Kerry you are going to he11. If you vote for any any candidate who doesn't follow their church's view of "Godliness," then you are going to he11. So in effect, this idiot says that all Democrats are going to he11. How many ways do you want me to put it? If you can't see anything wrong with someone like that, more power to you...you need it. And if you don't have a problem with someone who thinks like that being next in line for the Presidency, sleep well.
1 person likes this
@morethanamolehill (1586)
• United States
5 Sep 08
Maybe you should read my question. If I say G-D you, It means I am requesting your presence in Hell. If You tell me to go to hell, It means we will be in the same place. So my question is if you have no problem with Obama's pastor's statement, And this guy said basically the same thing, then why do you have a problem with his? The reason it doesn't live up to my screen name is that she actually left the church of her own volition. She didn't make a special speech defending him while saying that she wasn't there that day, Or any other day in question, before quitting the church and disassociating herself from the aforementioned pastor.
She was only there three years. This article you reference is a nightmare.haha First she asks a group of people for prayer on a specific issue. OMG what a disgrace. A politician asking for prayer!.!.!.!from Pentecostals. in A CHURCH OF ALL PLACES!! Holy Moly!! what are we gonna do!?!?! Democrats only preach in churches on Election Day!!!! and it's prayer for the soldiers that she's asking for....(hangs head in shame)
You know what!! Pastors still have a right to free speech and what you people are trying to do is silence speech that you don't like or that you disagree with it's a way of intimidating clergymen to only talk about "Approved Subjects" But if they step out of line they face the ACLU or other bully organization that threatens a lawsuit. HATE Speech Legislation is the same thing. Every Crime is a hate crime but that's not good enough is it? I've already spent more time on this that it deserves.
@morethanamolehill (1586)
• United States
5 Sep 08
"Her pastor says basically that..."
Pastor wright didn't "basically" say anything. he said it OUTRIGHT. LOuD anD PRoUd. When ever you have to qualify your statement, you lose cred. Just like in that article, They don't even quote an entire sentence, they put two separate quotes in one sentence to make it say w/e they want it to say. You know, I used to go a church where the pastor would do that and boy! he had some creative sermons.=D I left there.
It's funny how often I see the same tricks that "Hot Rod" pastors use, in the liberal Media. (I mean the sad kind of funny)
@shoffman2000 (560)
• Alexandria, Virginia
3 Sep 08
This is typical left wing shoddy journalism trying to create a story when there is no story
@CherylsPearls (1269)
• United States
4 Sep 08
It's a story, shoffman. It's new information about someone most of us know nothing about. That makes it a story.
@taface412 (3175)
• United States
3 Sep 08
In the link you provided, plus an additional one I looked up she and her family moved from the Assembly of God church to a nondenominational church in 2002. I also see it says she continues to worship in Assembly of God in Juneau. Either way that was six years ago when she and her family attended the church. Not six months ago. Second, the other article I read points how when the question of how it may influence her politcally states "Governor Palin is well able to speak for herself on those issues."
Now in comparison to Rev Wright and Kilnins and Obama and Palin...well, one like I said it didn't take a presidential campiagn to make her rethink her families activities in the church. and two, I lost respect for Obama when he at first stood behind Rev Wright as a "friend" and then when the visting pastor mad an @ss out of them again mocking H. Clinton decided maybe it was time to step back....
To me, these show characteristics of a person. There are many of us, probably including you, who have sat in a church or public meeting where they were members and did not agree 100% of what was being said. Considering she grew up in the church, and considering how small in comparison her hometown is she keeps in contact on friendly terms...but again it said she moved her family to a nondenominational church in 2002.
I honestly think everyone is having a hard time dragging up anything on this woman so they will take anything....
@taface412 (3175)
• United States
3 Sep 08
Oh, and I forgot to add wasn't Rev Wright also one who preached about 9/11 and I am rephrasing from memory didn't he not say the US deserved those attacks...or implied this? Fact is no matter what you do not have separation of church and state. Becuase we found it out with Obama and now people are trying to use this against Palin....
And do you believe everything the media offers you? Because I don't. I look at it this way....I do not want to know their inner lives, but I do because even though I try not to look I see it anyhow. So I step it up and look at their issues and their track record within their jobs. George Clooney had it right, the only way to stop all the garbage being spread is to stop buying the rag mags at the check out...unfortunately most of our media has become a sensationalized rag mag on 24/7.
@ZephyrSun (7381)
• United States
4 Sep 08
Ok sorry it's me again lol but MSM has picked up the story today. So here's the link....
http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-09-03-palin-pastor_N.htm
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