Was life really better under Clinton?
By DoriLentrich
@DoriLentrich (1016)
United States
September 12, 2008 5:36pm CST
I've heard a lot of people cite to how much better life was under Clinton for the average American as support for voting for Obama. I've also noted a trend that a lot of these people were young during Clinton's administration. However, plenty of older people are saying it as well.
But my question is was it? I don't remember it that way. I remember the largest tax increase in my lifetime. I remember an artificially inflated economy which crashed conveniently after Clinton left office. I remember a military cut to the bone while being over-taxed. I remember our secrets being sold to the Chinese. I remember a lot of things that don't seem to fit with this idyllic representation.
What do other people remember?
6 people like this
17 responses
@fwidman (11514)
• United States
12 Sep 08
I remember Clinton's term as being a heck of a lot more fun than Bush's The economy wasn't that bad, I was working then and not being taxed to harshly, the military is always being cut so I don't blame that on him personally. At least with Ckinton people still were able to keep the houses they bought Is any of that a reason to vote Obama? Nope
@kerriannc (4279)
• Jamaica
12 Sep 08
Hello my darling friend, I totally agree with you. This is no reason to vote Obama because everyone is different and because of this one need to look and see which individual is best to carry the America Country forward.
1 person likes this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
13 Sep 08
Kerri, if you look at McSames policies, he supports McBush at every turn, including his tax policy (mind you he voted against it twice, but supports it now, so either he is lying now, or was lying then), his foreign policy (walk loudly, and carry stick, but you can't use it because there isn't much left because it is in pieces in Iraq, and Afganistan), his energy policy (big tax breaks to oil companies so they can increase the price of oil, and destroy the economy), his economic policy (tax cuts for the wealthy because that worked so great the last 8 years, so lets try it again). I agree that his isn't a reason to vote for Obama, but it is a blue print for a growing economy, and a balanced budget. Two things McSame won't give the American people.
2 people like this
@mythicalphoenix (35)
• United States
22 Sep 08
I can't speak for anyone but myself - but in my opinion life was much better when Clinton was in office. I didn't have to worry about losing my job to overseas companies, if I lost my job I could find another fairly easily, and my cost of living was significantly less. Now it is a daily struggle, and I can not wait until his term is over. Gas prices are outrageous and Bush has no plans on stopping the increase and yet gas prices can flux up to .50 cents daily and vary as you drive down the street. I never had to work two jobs before (and I make more now than when Clinton was in office), or have struggled this badly. It may not have been a perfect term in office, but it was a whole lot better than it is now.
2 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
23 Sep 08
Bush doesn't control gas prices. The market does. China's and India's rise have made the oil prices skyrocket. If Bush could drill for oil thus increasing the supply, it should in the future make the prices go down. But you can thank Congress for making sure that doesn't happen, so it's not really Bush's fault.
As for the plethora of jobs, I was out of work for a year under Clinton, with a college degree. There were no jobs out there for me. Now, it's a little better.
And as to the cost of living, it was too low under Clinton. Everywhere we turned economists were marveling at how the cost of living wasn't rising with the times and wondering how long it could last. We found out. What we're going through now is hard, but it's an adjustment that needed to happen. The longer you artificially keep prices low, the more painful it is when they finally have to go up.
1 person likes this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
29 Sep 08
I agree that gas companies have been making large profits. However, what I have heard stated are gross profits, not net. If the cost of the barrel rises, profits will increase, but net profits may very well go down. However, I think all oil companies should be looked into for gouging. The prices at the pump do not follow the price of the barrel. However, saying that drilling will not produce immediate effects is incorrect. When the vote was going up before Congress there was a drop in barrel prices because there was a fear that the supply would shift. If the U.S. starts the process, there will be a drop in prices. If we had done it before, we might be where we are now.
As for China and India not having an impact, that goes again to net vs. gross profits. Their increased demand has increased the cost. Are the oil companies making out like bandits? I don't know. I suspect so, but I also know that just because you make more money in the gross column doesn't mean you're making more money in the net column.
Prices were too low. Our society was headed for an extremely painful readjustment for over a decade starting in the latter part of Clinton's administration. It has been my experience that the "tax the rich" policies of the Democrats produce a short-term alleviation for the classes you mention, but in the long run those people are the ones who are most seriously damaged. Because, you can't tax the corporations/small businesses in this country without that cost being passed on to the consumer which is the rest of us. When business has to pay exorbidnant amounts in taxes they have no incentive to grow making new jobs or increasing the wages of their current employees.
@mythicalphoenix (35)
• United States
24 Sep 08
Actually Bush to some extent does control gas prices because he has a vested interest in the oil companies and owns a drilling company. And oil companies made between 3 billion and 7.5 billion dollars in profit this year - China and India have nothing to do with American companies making profits off the sale of gas. These companies do not need to make that much profit, and it is at the expense of those who have the tightest budgets. And drilling like Bush suggests won't make a bit of difference since it takes 7 years before drilling can reach our supply lines because the process has to be started from scratch. So it will have no immediate impact on supply.
How can you say cost of living was too low? I am guessing you are not like me who is living only slightly above what is considered the poverty line. All Bush has done is increase everything, not raise wages, and made it profitable for American companies to move their business overseas. Because of Bush I can not afford to go back to school, because I can not afford a cut in my income.
Bush's policies affected those like me the hardest - the ones that are working thier hardest so they don't have to receive government support. Under Bush those who are in middle to lower middle class are having to pay for his decisions the most.
@WhatsHerName (2716)
• United States
25 Sep 08
Well yeah life was better under Clinton. Our biggest national calamity was weather or not he lied about doing Monica in the Oval Office. All the issues and problems were just a small snowball that has gradually rolled into the avalanche we have now.
Other than that, life was about the same for me.
2 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
9 Oct 08
Some might argue that there were other calamities under the Clinton administration, but I take your point. Thank you for responding.
@Qaeyious (2357)
• United States
24 Sep 08
I remember my mother telling me that she remembers gas prices at 25 cents a gallon, and she thinks it's been over-priced ever since.
I also had a better job under the Clinton administration (that is, I just happened to have a better job) - but it's not Bush's fault where I was then, and where I am now.
I like neither Democrat nor Republican - I call them Repubocrats. They are all the same to me, and I've been voting 3rd parties since the 1984 election (my third) - However, to Clinton's credit, I didn't lower my standards and voted Republican to get him out of office like I voted Democrat in the 2004 election to get Bush out of office. Most people will see how successful that strategy worked.
Well, no more. I will vote for the party I most agree with. - I was with the Natural Law Party, but they are no longer participating in national elections. I will vote for more local offices in that party, but I am still up in the air as to who to vote for for offices like president of the United States.
No, it will neither be Obama nor McCain.
2 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
29 Sep 08
Qaeyious:
For this country to get a viable third party, your strategy is the only way to go. Building from the local up seems to be the right way to get a third choice in the U.S.'s political system. To try and jump in at the highest level doesn't really accomplish much. Getting the people fired up to support candidates starts in our home towns. We are too used to the two party system which we've had for well over a hundred years.
Your frustration with the two parties is not unique. I know many people who feel our choices are too limited. But, it's important that you mention voting for the candidate who most accurately reflects your views. That's the whole point. If we forget to put the country's best interests (as we see them) before party politics, we end up making ourselves servants to the parties.
2 people like this
@melvinandheather1 (540)
• United States
13 Sep 08
Clinton was actually a really good president. Everyone was real hard on him because of the whole Monica Lewinsky scandel, however, presidents have been doing that stuff for years. Even have a back door where the girls come into the White House. Also the thing that I remember most from Clinton, was for one the Health Care, how many people did not worry about heatlh coverage because it was taken care of.
Another thing that I remember is the economy, the economy was in pretty good shape when Clinton was in office. He held it really well. It's not him that destroyed the economy, in all honesty there has not been one country that has went to war and not suffered economically. Look at Louis XIV he helped us out against King George and he went bankrupt. Another good example is the great depression, all of the economics reflect things that happen or occur in the country. I guess it is all how you look at it. I thought he was great for the economy and so does my professors who have taught me to look at the overall politics of the situation. Maybe though their was more scandel then we were aware of though, who knows. Great discussion.
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
I would argue whether he was a "really good president," but that's probably obvious by now. :)
However, health care was still tough under Clinton. The reason it was more accessible is more because the economy was booming (artificially) and people could pay their premiums. Also, a lot of the litigation which has made health care so cost prohibitive was starting to come through in Clinton's administration. That wasn't his fault, nor are the problems with health care Bush's doing.
I would also argue one point about war and economies. In the beginning war is good for the economy. The build-up, increase in employment, etc. provide a bump in the system. However, over the long haul, war is devastating on the economy. It cannot be sustained. Look at how WWII helped the U.S. pull itself out of the Great Depression. The Great Depression wasn't caused by war, it was saved because of it.
Most professors think Clinton was the greatest thing since sliced bread, but most of them also believe that Republican is a dirty word. But, it's nice to hear that you are learning to look at things from a fully rounded perspective. We'll still disagree, but it makes the argument more interesting.
You might want to consult with some of your economics professors before deciding that Clinton was great for the economy, though. Raising taxes = good economy is not an equation I've seen espoused by many of them.
@Millionmalls (26)
• United States
13 Sep 08
While you make some comparisons, why not gauge it this way:
Under which of these administrations do YOU suppose there has been a BIGGER EROSION of America's Middle-Class? We have an increasingly WEALTHY RULING CLASS in America, that literally controls the laws, courts and public institutions that the rest of us are forced to live with. The big have gotten just a little bit too big for the good of our Country and the majority of people living in it.
Now often, when I make that comment, I get called a communist, a socialist and so on. WELL, if we are to have socialism, let it be for the benefit of CITIZENS and NOT FOR HUGE FINANCIAL CORPORATE INTERESTS. I am sick of all the Republican cries for personal responsibility while we watch daily the gross irresponsibility of powerful corporations, who get bail out after baul out, while their corporate boards and officers collect millions, and that is just in their perks and bonuses.
I certainly think that this economy was doing far better under Clinton than it ever has under Bush. I actually still believe that Bush was NOT elected at all, we have been living under a dictatorship of the privileged corporate elite, we may as well call him KING, or EMPORER-- thank GOD that his brother didn't decide to run and carry on the will of the BUSHES!
I view this as perhaps the last chance that ORDINARY AMERICANS will have to make any inroad in reclaiming some power. My father was a veteran, my brother served, my deceased sister served in the Coast Guard and I KNOW they did not serve so that we could have a president with SEVEN HOMES, as record numbers of American Citizens have NONE, face foreclosures, evictions, job losses, get screwed out of their hard earned pensions-- I could go on and on.
Do I think people making OVER 250K a year NEED a tax break? NO.
Trickle Down Theories have NEVER worked, you just get a concentration of greedier and greedier people on top and needier and needier people at the bottom.
America never had the sort of class division that we do today. Today we have homeless families-- we have mentally ill citizens roaming about with no provisions or care-- we have criminal economies growing exponentially in every large city in America, WHY? Because that IS the only job in town in some of these neighborhoods.
I KNOW.
It is time for CHANGE. And it will remain time for CHANGE no matter who wins the election. And change will happen, because past a point, as more and more Americans become disillusioned and disenfranchised, change will come. I just hope it doesn't take another Civil War! Hopefully, we can still have elections where votes get counted. If so, I have little doubt that Barack Obama will WIN this election.
I do believe the Clinton's did not address the biggest issue we have today any better than the Bush camp has, and that is that there has been an incredible disproportionate distance between the haves and the have nots. I live in Massachusetts, and I will never forget how during the Clinton years, my agin mother paid MORE in taxes than Coca-Cola did! We have been needing some RADICAL changes for YEARS, hopefully NOW we will see some. At least that is MY hope.
And, no I am not a RADICAL, NOT A COMMUNIST, I belive in working, contributing and doing one's share-- that said, I also believe that NOBODY SHOULD OWN MORE HOUSES THAN THEY CAN COUNT! lol
2 people like this
@lloydanthony111 (4698)
• United States
14 Sep 08
Welcome to myLot and thank you for your well-thought-out reply. Some people just choose to ignore the facts.
The facts are that something has gone very wrong over the last eight years.
The CEO of our country must be held accountable for the condition of our country.
If Bill Clinton had taken a 500 million dollar plus surplus and turned it into a nearly trillion dollar deficit in only 8 years, those on the other side would never let us forget this.
But when it comes to George Bush he somehow gets a pass. As usual, the next Democratic Administration will have to clean up the mess left behind.
But we are up to these challenges. We've done it before and will do it again.
Lloyd
2 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
18 Sep 08
As you say, you are not a radical or a communist. You believe in contributing and doing one's share. Okay.
As for the cheap shot at McCain, fine he owns too many houses. Do some research find out how many houses Kerry owns, you'll find his net worth is substantially larger than McCain's also due to his wife.
As for the erosion of the middle class, you can find the seeds of that demise (though I disagree this point) in the administration of your beneficent leader, Clinton.
If you're going to hold how many homes someone owns against them, then perhaps the Democrats should nominate someone with no financial assets, someone who is a pristine as newly fallen snow. Though I doubt any member of either political party comes up to your high standards.
If you want to blame someone for the crisis in this country, don't blame the president, look to the Democrats in Congress. Everytime a bill came up that would have warned the American people about the impending crisis, they voted it down. Even when the Republicans "dominated" Congress under Clinton they had a slim majority. Thanks to the wisdom of the founding fathers (I mean that sincerely), a slim majority is the same as no majority.
There is enough blame to go around for the crisis we are currently in. As my question was about Clinton, I appreciate your emphatic response. However, I would point out that socialism believes in contribution of citizens. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need. Unfortunately that means that people are never actually rewarded for what they accomplish only given what they need. Makes for a frustrating existence. Which is why it doesn't work on a large scale.
1 person likes this
@whiteheather39 (24403)
• United States
22 Sep 08
I can only speak for myself but my life was much more comfortable. In general there was peace - no wars, much less unemployment, budget was out of deficit. The past 8 years have changed all that for the worse.
1 person likes this
@whiteheather39 (24403)
• United States
24 Sep 08
Actually if you had read what I said...I can only speak for myself but MY LIFE was much more comfortable.... and it was!
1 person likes this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
29 Sep 08
I did read what you wrote, however, if you look back you'll note that you made generalizations that went beyond your personal experience. "...-no wars, much less unemployment, budget was out of deficit." All of those are general statements about the country as a whole. With unemployment perhaps being the only one that you might have personally experienced somewhat.
Your life was more comfortable, I understand and appreciate that. However, I was addressing your additional comments.
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
23 Sep 08
Actually, if you look at the Treasury records from the time, the budget wasn't out of deficit. What really happened was that Clinton borrowed from Social Security to make it look like it was balanced. But his numbers would only work if Social Security was depleted when the Baby Boomers started collecting which would be about now. So, he didn't "really" balance the budget.
As for no wars, what about Kosovo? What about the other little skirmishes that he thought it prudent to invest our rapidly diminishing military in? Were we involved in a large scale single or double engagement, no. But that doesn't mean we weren't intimately involved with the strife that was going on throughout the world. There wasn't peace.
And as for much less unemployment, again, I urge you to look at the numbers. Over their tenure (most current numbers being included) Bush and Clinton were roughly equal in unemployment. The past 8 years haven't changed it for the worse, the past 8 years have seen the machine Clinton set in motion move to its logical end. What great national tragedies did Clinton deal with? He was in the right place at the right time and that's it.
1 person likes this
@suspenseful (40193)
• Canada
13 Sep 08
I live in Canada, but I remember the scandals, and that as soon as Clinton left office, the terrorists bombed the Twin Towers. Now I happen to know if they plan a strike like that, it was started while Clinton was president. I have lived long enough to see what happens to several presidents, and I did notice a trend that Democrats can do no wrong, and the Republicans get blamed for everything. I did notice that things got better under Bush, but then they started to blame him for things they would not have blamed Clinton for.
The thing wrong was those sub prime lenders and the people who bought houses they could not afford. I think the sub prime lenders were designed for those who had a temporary slump in jobs and the next year or months later would get a better or be rehired and not those who would never have a good paying job in their lifetime.
2 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
You have a unique perspective on the issue, being outside of it. However, I think your portrayal is accurate. You're completely right about the attack. Something that well-orchestrated didn't come together quickly. Also, Clinton was aware of the threat Osama bin Laden posed. Whether he ignored it or not, is a matter for debate. It is doubtful that Clinton fully apprehended how deep that threat actually was, and that is most likely not his fault.
Things did get better under Bush, but Americans always need a villain. It's similar to how Kennedy is lauded (for good reason) but everyone seems to forget that it was his administration that got us into Vietnam.
As for lenders, yep. Greed, contrary to Michael Douglas' famous line, is not good.
1 person likes this
@cbreeze (1205)
• United States
17 Sep 08
I remember the Clinton years a lot differently than what you described. I made much less and could afford much more. And I am not referring to credit debt. I could afford my house payments, I could afford food, I could afford gas. And it wasn't a struggle to afford it. I could even afford to save as well as have a little extra spending money. Not the case in the Bush years. Although I make considerably more money and I still do not live on credit, it is a struggle to meet the cost of heating my home, it is a struggle to afford the maintenance, it's a struggle to purchase food, it's a struggle to put gas in the car to go to work.
Now, I'm not saying Clinton walked on water. I do believe there are mistakes he made that also contributed to what we are experiencing now, but overall, I think the Bush administration has to take the brunt of the responsibility. Just my opinion.
1 person likes this
@cbreeze (1205)
• United States
22 Sep 08
To be truthful with you Dori, I am not sure How I feel about congress. Like many people in this country, I am uncomfortable. I do want to point my finger and say "Aha...it's because of this or that". But there is so much to take in that I truly can't say for sure what I understand about what has brought us to the point we are now. I guess I feel big business is greedy and politicians are in bed with them and we suffer the consequences. And I try to be careful about what criticism I make about any candidate because my perception may be skewed. The best I can do is vote my conscience.
2 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
22 Sep 08
And it's a valid one. However, I would point out that prices were unreasonably low during the Clinton years (not necessarily his fault). Everywhere I looked I was told that prices had not risen the way they were supposed to. The economy could not support that kind of treatment and an adjustment would have to come eventually. It was good while it lasted, but it wasn't going to last forever. So, in that regard, it's not easy, but it had to happen. Prices will never remain the same throughout time.
As to the gas issues. I pointed out in my response to thegreatdebater that China and India's rise have caused a great strain on the oil industry. That is hardly Bush's responsibility. Those two countries have increased demand by leaps and bounds which in turn has forced the price up as well.
The cost of food is a complex one. One of the reasons it has gone up is because of farmers switching their farms over to produce biofuels. This has affected the entire world's food production. From the farmer's standpoint, it makes perfect sense to maximize the amount of money they make from their fields. Unfortunately, it kills us at the grocery store. Since, the press for this move has come from a lot of Democratic fronts, again I think "blaming" Bush is misplaced. We should look to ourselves and our demand for cheaper fuel.
However, if you feel that Bush has to take the brunt of responsibility, where do you stand on Congress? Do they share any of the blame as well?
1 person likes this
@kerriannc (4279)
• Jamaica
12 Sep 08
My friend I don't live in America never been there but I follow world news. Under Clinton administration there were good things and the economy was great because when America Economy is doing good then the third world countries are doing well. Clinton leave a good Economy that Bush came and abuse and mash up. What these persons are saying is true and if you look with out a political color you will see that it is the truth.
It is because of this I was routing for Hilliary to be Vice President because she and Bill could assist Obama when he wins. I hope though that he will give him a advisory position. He will be receiving a country that is not doing well and he need all the helps that he can get when he wins.
1 person likes this
@kerriannc (4279)
• Jamaica
14 Sep 08
Xfactor, I have relatives that lives in America and under the administation of Clinton they did not cry as much as they are doing now. Just remember that you don't have to live in America to feel the pinch. Whenever America sneezes the other countries receive a cold. I follow Worldwide politics to the end and I am telling you that I know it is not everything one reads or watch in the media is true but you should also remember that whatever affect America, Europe and Canada we in the Caribbean feels the effect.
So you don't have to live in these countries to know what is happening there. Please to have an open mind. I can remember under the Clinton Administration there good things happening in the Caribbean. Since this administration we are here suffering the hard way.
Kudos
Kerry
2 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
I would be careful of using the media of any country to judge what life was like for the individual citizens of that country. What was your country's response to Clinton as a leader?
However, I should point out that Bush received a country that was on the down turn when he took office. Clinton did not leave a good economy, he rode one out. Also, one year into his first administration he was at the helm when America suffered its first foreign attack on the continental 48 in over one hundred years. That kind of landmark event can have all sorts of effects.
1 person likes this
@bombshell (11256)
• Germany
14 Sep 08
i can only say when Clinton was a president there was no war! thats all there was PEACE.
1 person likes this
@jend80 (2071)
• United Kingdom
24 Sep 08
Kosovo never happened then? and I must have imagined the news reports about Clinton haqving to be talked out of bombing Iraq at the last minute by Kofi Annan + front page reports/photos of apparently injured inocents and a gloating Bin Laden - the resault of a failed strike.
Maybe this only got reported in England at the time and not in America?
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
21 Sep 08
Actually, you'll find there was pleny of war. And America was intimately involved with a lot of it. That was the irony of Clinton's cutting the military while deploying it extensively.
1 person likes this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
13 Sep 08
Sounds like you must have Amnesia Dori. I was younger when Bill Clinton was president, but I do remember being able to fill up the tank in my 1984 LeBaron for less than $10.00 (9 gallon tank), and I remember having no problem finding a job, I also remember watching CNBC listening to all of the money being made, and republicans spending hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars because they couldn't beat him in an election. Those are the facts about the Clinton years, and I can tell you right now Bush would give one of twins for Clinton's economy. Bill Clintons't tax increase led to the largest boom market in the last 30 years. I hate to tell you this, but there is something called economic cycles, right now Bush's boom (well for the people making six figures on up) is busting as we speak (I see you forgot all about that). One of my favorite memories of the Bush Sr. administration was the picture of Rummy, and D!ck Cheney going over the cuts that they were going to implement in military funding (now republicans will never admit this happened, even when you show them the youtube video, they act like four year olds having a temper tantrum holding their hands up over their ears screaming "I can't hear you"). I remember Bush sending millions of jobs over to China, and the American people sending tens of billions of dollars over to a communist country, so Wal-Mart can sell us cheap products, and we fund our next enemies military. I remember George W. Bush walking into office with a budget surplus (that was long gone four months into office), I remember the price of gas at $1.09 a gallon in 1998 (yes that is right ten years ago it as that cheap), I remember the price of a durm of oil at $10.00, I remember the oil companies complaining about losing money, and OPEC crying about price. My, how things have changed for the worse in only 10 years, No wonder the American people want Barack in office, the world can't afford another George W. Bush, and McCain supports everyone of Bush's failed policies.
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
I don't have amnesia, never have. Nor do I look at history through a shallow lens.
I'm well aware of economic cycles. Even studied them a bit. I'm also aware raising taxes is never the way to boost the economy. You're right there was an economic boom during the Clinton administration, however it was completely unrelated to his policies. You may have heard of this neat little thing called the internet which fueled the economic boom to exorbidant highs. Now you might be able to attribute that to Clinton, because as we all know Gore invented the Internet. If you look back at what the economists were saying (note: not CNBC) they were warning of the over-inflation of the market, predicting the eventual downturn. In fact, if you look back, you'll find someone named Buffet started pulling his money out before Clinton left office. Also, fueling this boom were the double-book tactics of entities like Enron and Worldcom. Now, if you would like to attribute that to Clinton, please, be my guest. Clinton was in the right place at the right time. He didn't do anything to make it happen.
As for gas prices. Funny thing about that. There is this theory of supply and demand. If supply remains the same and demand goes up, the price goes up as well. During Clinton's administration, India and China weren't buying oil like it was going out of style. And with the fall of the Soviet Union (not Clinton's doing) neither was Russia. That left little old U.S. of A. While we consume an inordinate amount of oil, we don't consume enough to make up the shortfall left in the wake of the Cold War.
As for Bush shipping our jobs off to China, there is another economic concept you may be familiar with called solvency. For good or for ill, it's expensive to employ people in this country and with no incentives for companies to keep their workforce domestic, they do the logical thing which is to stay in business. On the surface that is good for the economy, unfortunately it's bad for the workforce which is bad for the economy. And since Democrats hate the idea of businesses doing anything with their money but paying Washington, there is a bit of a catch-22. However, we're in agreement that outsourcing is bad for the economy.
As you and I are around the same age, we must have been living in different places. Jobs were scarce. Especially if you lived in one of the small towns economically destroyed when Clinton shut down the military base keeping you afloat. Remember, "the threat is gone."
Cutting the military has been a favorite tactic of many politicians. Under Clinton it became an art form.
Memories are good. We remember things differently, and there's nothing wrong with that. I had a Mustang, by the way. However, accusing people of having amnesia when you can't take off your rose-colored glasses is short-sighted.
@my2boys (821)
• United States
13 Sep 08
I think the country was a ot better when Clinton was president. I think that he was a great president. We didnt have half the problems that we have now. However, I am not voting for Obama. He is a totally different person from Clinton.
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
You're right, Clinton is shoddy support for voting for Obama. Personally, (as is obvious) I don't think he was a great president. But luckily we live in a country where we can disagree.
1 person likes this
@divinchris (2449)
• India
13 Sep 08
I agree that life was really great under the Clintons.Economy was booming those days.Now its the reverse,county is in recession now.Jobless,sub prime crisis,and lot many problems.
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
15 Sep 08
You were 14 when Clinton left office. You've already forgotten that he left the country in a recession that began during his last two months in office. Jobless? You were too young to legally have a job even during his last year in office.
2 people like this
@jmhall (143)
• United States
13 Sep 08
You mentioned the subprime crisis. If you are meaning the housing market and their lending issues that actually started taking place during the Clinton admin. I worked in real estate at that time and that is when lenders started offer mortgages for 100% or more of the value of your home and the market was doing so well that they figured they would recoup. Well the market started going sour and the bottom fell out but it was too late to do anything about it. They started pulling back and everything but the spiral had already started. This should have never been started to begin with. I myself was told by a small local bank that they would allow me to borrow 100% of the value of my home. Thankfully I did not at the time.
1 person likes this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
divinchris:
Again, I assert Clinton was in the right place at the right time. In fact, I will go so far as to say that his policies are what led to the downturn you are describing. However, we are not in a recession. If you look at the numbers unemployment is not that much higher than it was during Clinton's boom. As for a lot more problems, yeah, there are. But I think you'll find that most of them were not created by any administration.
@rogue13xmen13 (14403)
• United States
13 Sep 08
I remember life being better under Clinton. Things were not so expensive. Gas was a heck or a lot cheaper, and there was no major war going on. Yes, I was a child in the 1990's, but does it matter? Clinton was nowhere near as bad as Bush.
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
15 Sep 08
"and there was no major war going on."
Wrong. Clinton was waging an illegal war in former Yugoslavia despite it being voted down by congress 427-2. The liberal media just chose to ignore it and pretend it wasn't happening. Fascinating how war coverage is so much different when the president is a democrat.
3 people like this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
How old you were does matter. It's very different when your parents are paying for everything compared to when you are paying for it yourself. As for things being cheaper, they were cheaper in the '80s vs the '90s and so on throughout history. Does that mean Reagan was nowhere near as bad as Clinton? No. If you look, many of the things we purchase now are adjusting in price to fit inflation.
2 people like this
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
13 Sep 08
My life and financial situation ahs been up and down. And it had nothing whatsoever to do with who was in office. I remember good financial tiemes and bad under all the administrations I have lived under. I don't place my financial destiny in the hands of one man and the governemtn doesn't set my station in life. Every personal financial hardship I can recall, has been thge result of decisions I have made, or circumstances that fall under eh catergory of "life happens"
1 person likes this
@jmhall (143)
• United States
13 Sep 08
I could not agree with you more. No one man or woman rules your destiny. We as consumers have made bad decisions over the years and are now paying the price. Yes I will agree that the war and gas prices have not helped but that is not the only problem. We as consumers need to take responsibility for our own decisions.
1 person likes this
@DoriLentrich (1016)
• United States
13 Sep 08
Both of you are right. There are too many factors that determine an individual's economic well-being to place the blame or praise on the head of one elected official. However, the direction a country takes is one those factors. So, there is a certain relationship between the two.
But, and you are absolutely right about this, personal responsibility is the beginning and end of how one's life goes. Being a leaf in the wind gets you going around in circles.
Thank you both.
@jmhall (143)
• United States
13 Sep 08
I will agree with the basis of what they are saying. Yes the economy and the state of our country was better during the time period that CLinton was president. However, that had very little if anything to do with the president himself. IMO congress is the one that really has the ability to change things they are the one that can make or break this country as are the American people. If we have a problem with the way things are going them we are the ones that need to do something about it. The president it just one person. Yes he/she has influence and yes he/she has some power but they are not all powerful and can be voted down when it comes to their policies and ideas for running the government. What people do not like to remeber is that the economy started to down slide during the Clinton administration but they were too busy looking into his private life at that time to really take notice. It take several months for things to really show up in our economy. I am not saying that Bush has been a saint and great leader but it has not been entirely his doing.