Should illegal immigrants have USA driver's licenses? Sen. Obama says "YES" ...

Great points, Destiny!

Hello Destiny, I agree! They became criminals as soon as they broke our immigration laws. Grrrr! The California issue has got me spitting bullets! Did you hear Sen. Obama's 4 Part Plan released today? He specifically referenced making immediate loans available to cities and states. Meaning that Sen. Obama supports bailing out "sanctuary states" without demanding that they get their budgets under control by cutting illegal immigrant spoon-feeding. I cannot even describe how perterbed I am over this. I guess that I'm just an old curmudgeon because I don't want to pay (literally) for California's stupid, stupid, stupid, and grossly abusive mistakes!

The reason most Americans don't see the problem is because the MSM nd the left are blaming capitalism, and most Americans believe anything that the MSM says. They have been slowly and gradually indoctrinating everyone into believing that capitalism is bad and socialism is good. This has been going on in our schools for at least the last 50 years or more, and it has been done in small increments. Revisionist history is now appearing in textbooks that is inaccurately portraying past events. The media is emphasizing the wrong things and spoon feeding propaganda. When you control the media, then you control the people. I read somewhere that the media is controlled by just a few people who own the news outlets. Is it any wonder that Americans have no clue?

Hello Taskr, I was just sharing our exchange with my husband. He is of the impression that I may be misinterpreted as not completely agreeing with you because of my own failure to mention that I share your concerns about our citizens apathy and misappropriated concerns. You and I have so often come up on the same side of the most controversial issues that I expected that you would fully interpret my agreement with you. However, I left the other viewers to draw their own conclusions -- shame on me! To clear up any confusion, Taskr's wise words should ring as loudly as the bells of St. Patrick's Cathedral to every American. Apathy and petty diversion will be the end of us, if we don't fight it with all our might!

Thanks Taskr! I agree that single issue voting has been the bane of decades worth of elections in our nation. Of course, I don't see that changing until Economics, Critical Thinking, and accurate History and Civics academia return to the halls of our public education institutions.

Don't worry, I understood you just fine. I'm sick of single-issue voters who will ignore 99% of what a candidate stands for and I'm sick of voters who care more about petty, insignificant things like wealth and where a candidate's wife shops over relevant issues.

wow! Thanks for sharing that! Puts a new perspective on things....thats for sure.

You're welcome, Ambkeb! Thanks for taking the time to read my reply -- I appreciate your effort.

Hello Ambkeb, Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. I agree 100% By the way, as I understand it, that packet of fake documents would cost someone about 2k in my state! Of course, the price has gone up since the "Motor Vehicle Ring" was busted up by law enforcement. Before the drivers license ring was busted up, illegals were being bussed to my state from all over the nation, where they were getting N.M. licenses for $1300.00 each. It wasn't just illegals from south of the border either. The Russian Mob had a regular chartered bus program to get illegals from NYC to Albuquerque so that they could get those fake IDs. Of course, the bus ride was in addition to the $1300.00 Please note the time-line of the three news accounts listed below. [i]"A criminal complaint was filed against a Brazilian man and a Kazakhstan woman after federal agents arrested 10 illegal immigrants in an investigation into an alleged smuggling operation involving fake documents to obtain New Mexico driver’s licenses. FBI spokesman Darrin Jones said investigators learned several illegal immigrants living in New Mexico were charging thousands of dollars to help other illegal immigrants travel to the state to get licenses. Hmmm…why would illegal aliens from all over the country travel out to New Mexico for this particular service? New Mexico, Hawaii, Maine, Maryland, Oregon, Utah and Washington do not require drivers to prove legal status to obtain a license. In 2003, Gov. Bill Richardson signed a measure into law that allowed foreign nationals , including those living illegally in the country , to obtain a driver’s license. His office has said one of the deciding factors in signing the bill was public safety. Applicants for a New Mexico driver’s license who don’t have a Social Security number can present identification such as a tax identification number, a foreign passport or a Matricula Consular issued by the Mexican government."[/i] http://michellemalkin.com/2008/05/06/national-fake-id-ring-exploited-new-mexicos-lax-drivers-license-rules-for-otm-aliens/ "In the past, there have been several instances where thieves have broken into offices and have stolen either our driver's license machine or printer as well as card stock and material to produce driver's licenses," he said.... The changes will start around the last week in February(2008), Ortiz said Thursday." http://www.santafenewmexican.com/Local%20News/State_driver_s_licenses_go_high_tech Matt Mygatt | The Associated Press 12/6/2007 "According to the news release, investigators are still working on the investigation, and believe that dozens of “special interest illegal aliens” may have obtained New Mexico licensees using fraudulent documents" http://blog.americancongressfortruth.com/2008/05/04/fbi-busts-special-interest-illegals-in-new-mexico/ Above are three excerpts from news stories listed chronologically: 2006, 2007, and 2008. Please note that the FBI bust of "special interest illegal aliens" was in May '08, after the security changes to NM license application process were phased in Feb. '08. So, the NM taxpayer is footing the bill for all of these new security protocols, yet it hasn't made a bit of difference for illegals getting IDs. It's only made the process that much more complex, costly, and burdensome for legal citizens!

Hello MissGia, Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. To your comment, my most poignant reply is: Exactly!

Hello Hermitcrabheaven, Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. Yes, I would absolutely say that American citizens are having a tough enough time right now, without having to pay for people from other nations who are here illegally, taking advantage of our sense of charity and good will. If Sen. Obama is elected, he'll be working with Nancy Pelosi, 'Mrs. San Francisco values' and Harry Reid. There will be no balance of power in Washington. If Sen. Obama is elected can anyone imagine that the state of California would be denied it's request for a taxpayer bail-out? And, who's going to demand that California cease it's pro-illegal policies? No one, that's who! California will continue to coddle illegal immigrants, and the American taxpayer, not just the California taxpayer, will be footing the bill. I don't know about anyone else, but I am NOT OK WITH THAT!

Hello RDugas, You raise some interesting questions. Our economy does need a serious overhaul, including regulation reevaluation, and a complete systemic tax slash and burn. The jobs issue will not see a correction until those larger issues are addressed. However, our immigration policy is a perfect little micro of many of the larger issues leading to our current state of stagflation. A serious investigation of immigration collateral damage would shine a spotlight on many of the reforms that are most pressing, at this time. In an earlier response I provided some statistics about illegal immigrants and displaced American workers. Yup, you're right -- it is definitely a jobs issue! So, why has Sen. Obama not shifted his support for open borders, and amnesty? It would seem that he is missing the point about how much illegal immigration affects two of his preferred issues, which are health care and the economy. I simply do not understand how he can be so disconnected!

Hello Gewcew, I agree that 'good fences make good neighbors'. As an American taxpayer, I absolutely INSIST that sanctuary cities and states ascribe to our federal laws; immigration and otherwise. If Sen. Obama supports bailing out California, then we'd darned well better get a commitment for good behavior in return! To Hades with Gavin Newsom, Barbara Boxer, and Nancy Pelosi! They've all gotten rich off the backs of the taxpayer -- let them and the rest of the Hollywood elite bail out their own state's failed policies!!!

Oh, and Gewcew -- thanks so much for sharing your thoughts on this. As I read your points, I couldn't help but be reminded of Mexico's national immigration policies. Mexico's Immigration Policy: Hypocritical? http://vivirlatino.com/2006/06/02/mexicos-immigration-policy-hypocritical.php Mexico's official immigration policy: Incidentally, if someone wishes to become a Mexican citizen, in addition to a whole host of other requirements to be fulfilled, the person must "... be able and prepared to invest at least 26.000* times the minimum daily wage in Mexico City, and apply for an FM2 visa." Hmmm, does that mean that Mexico doesn't want the poor from other countries seeking citizenship in their country??? http://www.mexperience.com/liveandwork/immigration.htm Oh and Gewcew, I'll bet that you'll find the following link very, very interesting! "Let's call Mexico's bluff on its unwarranted interference in U.S. immigration policy. Let's propose, just to make a point, that the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) member nations standardize their immigration laws by using Mexico's own law as a model." http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=14632

Hello Emeraldisle, It's so nice to visit with you! You and I have long agreed on this issue. Citizen benefits are just that, for our citizens! As well, your point is spot on -- illegal aliens demonstrate a total disregard for the USA's laws when they first violate our immigration laws! I cannot support any politician who supports rewarding bad behavior, and punishing good behavior. That is such an upside down approach to governance, and it has got to be stopped!

Hello Emeraldisle, Yup, you're absolutely right -- this has been placed on a back burner, and it really needs to be drudged up to the forefront of election issues. That our elected continue to reward bad behavior, and punish good behavior is indeed beyond maddening! Thanks for sharing!

Hi ladyluna :) It was nice to see your discussion on this. I think for many this issue has been put on the back burner in comparison to other hot issues. This is one though we cannot continue to ignore. We need to get a handle on it and realize that by giving more and more to illegals it is only encouraging more and more to come. We need to stand firm and stop giving away this country to them and start retaking it for ourselves.

Hello Laglen, Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this issue. Earlier in this discussion I placed a link to a suggestion that the USA ought to seek to insert into the NAFTA treaty an article that would state that all parties to the treaty should acknowledge and adhere to a standard immigration quid pro quo -- using the Nation of Mexico's immigration policies as the standard. Yeah, that'd go over like a lead balloon, eh???

oops.... should read any and all benefits

Hello Twoey, Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. Ya' know, the way illegal aliens get their driver's licenses is to buy stolen social security numbers, thereby putting legal citizens like you and me through a living nightmare to reclaim our own identities. In a previous response I shared some statistics about illegal alien identity theft. The average stolen social security number gets sold to 30 different illegal aliens. Imagine trying to untangle that identity theft disaster? I doubt that Sen. Obama will ever fully recover from Jill Stanek's public expose of the Illinois State Infant Born Alive Act!!!

Unfortunately, yes I have. Grrrrrrr!!! You might be interested in taking a peak at the letter linked to below. http://thesop.org/index.php?article=13562

Hello Morethanamolehill, Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. I will check out your discussion about voter fraud. Typically I would agree with your summary about the "undecided's". However, this year I believe that there really are people who sincerely dislike both candidates. At this point, I don't know what will cause them to make up their minds between the great 'lesser of two evils'. I can only hope that this very important issue of illegal immigration and citizen benefits can help people to reach a decision that they will be comfortable with. I know that it's such an all encompassing issue that it is a 'deal maker' or 'deal breaker' for me, and many people that I've talked with recently. I just think that people forgot about how much this issue affects our economy, security, and national quality of life.

Have you heard that about 5 million of the defaulted homes we are bailing out belong to illegals?

Hello Patms1, I may be a little late, but welcome to MyLot! If this is any indication of the quality of the contributions that we can expect from you in the future, then I very much look forward to your future submissions! Yours is a very thoughtful and thought provoking response, and you've shown no fear. I sincerely respect that! Nope, you're not the only one who heard the national anthem sung in a language other than our own. Or who saw the Mexican flag flown above our own. Or who heard the sincere threats of Aztlan Reconquista and MS-13. They absolutely believe that they are entitled to take the Southwestern USA as their own. Nope, you're definitely not alone with your concerns, Patms1!!!

Hello Spalladino, Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. Let me see if I'm understanding your points: 1. If your figures of 12 million/2 million are accurate (I'm neither questioning the stats nor agreeing with them) then you're saying that 16.66% of Ca. Latinos/Hispanics can be considered as "ONLY about 2 million"? Hmmm, you'll have a very difficult time selling me on the notion that 16.66% of any subsect of our nation's population, as being here ILLEGALLY, is not a staggering problem in serious need of immediate attention! And, I doubt that I am alone in this concern. 2. I also doubt that you need to explain to most Americans that one of the principle issues in deeming English as our nation's OFFICIAL LANGUAGE has everything to do with not incurring the exhorbitant costs of printing all federal documents in a plethora of foreign languages. Or, in requiring our government to foot the bill for translators to provide language services to federal detainees and criminals who have broken our laws. I'm pretty sure that we all understand that, and that that is a huge part of the reason why it's been estimated that between 70%-85% of all Americans support English as the OFFICIAL language of the United States of America. 3. Emergency rooms? Hmmm, your mention of illegal aliens bludgeoning the budgets of our nations Emergency Rooms is perhaps the most relevant issue in this debate. Do you realize that you are seriously out of step with your fellow citizens if you support Spanish signage in American Emergency Rooms to support illegal immigrants who are sucking our health care system dry? You say that English should be the predominant language in the USA. I say that you and Sen. Obama are both absolutely WRONG! Perhaps you two should be lobbying every other nation on the planet to abandon their designations of their official national languages?

I live in Florida as well and see billboards and all forms of things in Spanish. It does make me mad. They are spending money to put things up in two or more languages when one language should be enough. Also where do we draw the line? We have a huge Greek and Polish section in my area. Should they have signs and pamphlets and other items in those as well? What about French? Italian? Chinese? Every major city has huge populations that speak that as well. Should everything be made in all languages? If I moved to another country I would be expected to learn their language, not have them cater to me. I have known people who have lived here more then ten years and still do not speak English, who don't even bother to learn. Why should they when the government keeps pandering to them? We need to stop that. We need to pick one language for our country (at this point I don't care what language, just pick one) and have everyone use it.

Yeah, how good is the Illegal Immigrant situation in the Philippines? Or wait, you are being sarcastic too, right?

Hello Oneidmnster, I'm a little late, but I'll congratulate you for your 500 post mile-marker anyway. Hearty Congrats & enjoy that cut/paste function!!! In response to your thoughts here, I have to agree 100%. Few of our politicians have made an effort to explain how disastrous this forced blending of socialism and capitalism has been. Yet, study after study after study has demonstrated how negatively illegal immigration has impacted our national economy. The number of hospitals that have been bankrupted and forced to close in the past five years alone should speak volumes to any voter who claims to be concerned about our health care system.

Hello Kymommy72, Thank you for pointing out that Americans do not resent immigration. We simply resent illegal immigration. Excellent point! I agree that legal immigration is a valued part of the pulse of America. As well, that we do need to take care of our own first. This goes back to rewarding good behavior and punishing bad behavior, as opposed to the upside down reality that Obama/Pelosi/Reid have been shoving down our throats. In fact, the only of Sen. Obama's funding measures that he has agreed to table since the economy went south is his promise to fund his international poverty erradication program -- to the tune of $850 billion American taxpayer dollars per year! Where I can respect his admission that the American Taxpayer cannot affort $850 billion per year, his statement to table the funding promise was conditional. The liability is only off the table while the economy is in such trouble, meaning that he still expects America to fix the rest of the world's problems -- on our dime. How is that good for our economy? Of course, Sen. Obama seems to have no understanding of the economic impact of illegal immigration on our nation. If you and I get it, shouldn't he and his 300 advisors? Hmmmm, I have to ask: Why is he unwilling to acknowledge the far-reaching problems that illegal immigration causes?

Hello Syankee525, Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. You seem to be on the same page with the majority of respondents here: Legal immigration is welcomed. Illegal immigration is definitely NOT!

Hello Thegreatdebater, Thanks for the clarification, I appreciate your follow up. So, you were questioning how many Americans would support illegal aliens having valid drivers licenses? I don't know that any opinion research has been conducted on that specific issue nationally, though I can share that the public support of illegal alien drivers licenses in my border state is negligable! You might be assauged to know that I am 100% consistent on all aspects of this issue. I DO NOT support American businesses, or American politicians who desire a permanent second-class in this nation! In fact, I support tougher measures than most in regard to businesses hiring illegals! To your last point about Sen. McCain: Do you remember the many attacks on our current President for seeming to have an aversion to admitting his own mistakes? I see that same trend in Sen. Obama -- particularly in his denial that the surge has worked, that socialism is a contradiction to our national structure, or that he personally, has a long string of problematic associations and demonstrably poor judgement. And, let there be no mistake -- I vehemently disagreed with Sen. McCain and Sen. Lindsay 'Grahamnesty', yet as much as I disagreed with 'comprehensive immigration reform', I have to offer a degree of respect to Sen. McCain for saying that The American People were right and that he was wrong! McCain willingly surrendered his own vision for that of 'We The People'. Where those millions have denounced Bush for not being able to admit when he was wrong, those same character judges must now acknowledge that Sen. McCain has admitted that he was wrong on his immigration stance, and has modified his intention to more closely match the overwhelming majority of our citizens! Sen. Obama has made no such concession! Returning us, full circle, to my point in an earlier reply: If Obama, Pelosi and Reid are in charge of our nation, without any sizeable opposition, why should any American believe that the three socialists won't impose their 'vision' onto the rest of us, despite our vehement objections???

Luna, thank you for your response. We have no idea how many illegals there on in the United States, that is why I said that this could be a good start to find out. When I asked the question: How many would actually do it if we allowed it anyways, was point toward the allowing illegals to have ID or a drivers license. I know that alot of Americans support deportation, but you would be surprised how many corporations are fighting this. They can pay these illegals a fraction of what they would pay a legal employee, they also don't have to worry about workmens comp, social secruity, taxes, or health care. They have also sent alot of money to Washington so their current policies stay in place. I agree with you on illegal immigration, but John McCain isn't anti-immigration, either. So you have two men with the same stance on immigration running for office, both of which you don't agree with. So good luck with moving your agenda, neither have any desire to talk about something they both agree on.

Luna, I don't really know how many people want illegal immigate ID, or drivers Licences, but like I said it might help us figure out what to do about then when we have actual numbers to deal with. It is good to hear that you feel the same way I do about businesses and the way our politicians look at this issue. I do agree that Obama is like Bush, in the way that he does not always admit when he is wrong about something. However, when people talk about socialism you have to look at Bush's policies, and ideals, and compare them with the structure of the Socialist Party. Remember this $700 Billion dollar bail out was Bush's idea, and if you have looked at the recent job numbers you will notice that the Government is the only one hiring, and at an alarming rate. Mr. Bush gave the Airline industry billions after 9/11, he also fought the boarder fense, and I personally watched a speach in my home town where George W. Bush, standing next to the president of Mexico, said that we need to open the boards to Mexico. The reason that McCain changed his mind about immigration is because he knew he wouldn't get the nomination with his current stand (this is one of McCain's many flip flops). As I just pointed out Bush's Socialist ideals are very alarming, and it makes Obama's ideas look more centralist than Bush's. If you want to accuse someone of being a socialist, you need to look at Bush, and then look at McCain's policies, which are in lock step with Bush's. But, that is just my opinion.