Obama's Tax Plan

Good points, jonesy! Zephyr's post is like Obama's plan: oversimplified. It just isn't that easy, and there is no way that he can do it without adding more taxes. He HAS voted those 94 times for no cuts or higher taxes, and those times were NOT just for the wealthy. How long before he adds more to everyone's taxes. How long before he decides that those making $80,000 a year can afford to give more to run his big plans? The risk to small businesses from the Obama plan are DIRE. Sure, if you are an individual, working for some big company and you make $200,000 (the income level that the tax kicks in for single people), you are doing OK But if you run a small business, employing a few people, like most of us have in our neighborhoods and around town, that $250,000 has to cover a LOT. The take home pay of that business owner is NOT going to be $250,000. These businesses cannot afford such a strain, esp at this point in our country's financial situation. McCain's plan may not be perfect, but it hurts no one, and makes much more sense. He does NOT just give the rich a tax break and wait for it to trickle down! He is NOT for taxing any higher period. McCain's health care is better than Obama's, as well. May not be perfect, but it's a reasonable start -- esp compared to Obama's laws, fines, and high taxes.

the, "He HAS voted those 94 times for no cuts or higher taxes, and those times were NOT just for the wealthy. " Why don't you reseach those bills and see what was attached to them. That's what I did. You can also go to factcheck and look at it as well. It's old news. "But if you run a small business, employing a few people, like most of us have in our neighborhoods and around town, that $250,000 has to cover a LOT. The take home pay of that business owner is NOT going to be $250,000. " Lets see Obama said no capital gains tax on small business owners. Tax cuts for small business' that offer health benefits. And, my final note on the subject and I've only said this 100 times here, IF small business is so worried about it set up an Llc. It is actually so much better for business owners than a sole proprietor and has much more protection for the business owner.

McCain's plans have been totally misrepresented. He is NOT saying an across the board tax cut! He is saying keep the taxes where they are, He wants to stop capital gains tax for I think 2 years, to help get thru this crisis where people have lost their retirement or most of it. He is just wanting to keep taxes basically where they are. He wants to freeze spending except on necessary things, such as medicare, defense, etc, for one year, while we go thru the budget and decide what needs to be cut, improved, changed, whatever. He wants to cut out all the excess spending -- not needs, but pork barrel nonsense. He wants to BALANCE the BUDGET. That IS the number one thing that needs to be done, in order to put the US on strong financial footing again: stop the crazy spending and BALANCE the BUDGET. Obama says he will raise taxes only on the smallest percent of the population. He will fine small businesses and PARENTS -- did you hear that in the 2nd debate -- for not providing health care, but he does not really explain HOW they will provide it if they can't afford it. he wants 1 TRILLION dollars in new spending! That's 1 trillion in addition to the huge amount our government is spending right now. But he doesn't make it clear how/where he will get the money, and no one I've heard can see how he can do it. What is he going to cut? Barney Frank says they will cut defense by one quarter??? While we're at war? Even tho Obama wants out of Iraq, he wants to go full force into Afghanistan. He's also mentioned going into Pakistan, "taking out" Iran. And he wants to bring back the draft?????? All while cutting the defense budge by one fourth???? There is just too much going on here. I can't put my faith in a plan with so many holes and unanswered questions. I agree Obama is a charming and personable man. He is a fantastic public speaker. But in all honesty, he really is not showing anything that he WILL do, that we can COUNT on, that he CAN do. At least with McCain, we know who he is and what he stand for. We know for a fact he is FOR less crazy spending and FOR a BALANCED BUDGET. There's only so much harm he can do. He is for reasonable, normally accepted foreign relations, not spouting off about who he will invade, in a campaign, as Obama has done. We're at a very critical moment in our history. We just cannot afford Obama right now. Maybe his time should be in 4, 8, or 12 more years. I want someone who has a real record that I can see and check into. Obama really hasn't done that much, and what he has done doesn't square with his promise of not raising taxes on us who make less than his cut off. the real facts just don't support his plans or his promises.

Well your answer sounds good in theory but business has been running on Bush policies for 8 years and we have more unemployment now than the Clinton years. So for the past 8 years business' have had that tax cut, where the hell are the jobs? "Wonder why all those jobs are leaving American and going over seas?" Because Bush and the Republican House and Senate allow for tax cuts for companies sending jobs overseas. "Because America has the second highest tax rate on companies (only japan is higher). " The lastest number that I read on this, 2/3's of all American companies pay NO (Zero) federal taxes. So if they are running off to other countries it isn't because of the US tax code.

Lil, we have tried lower taxes on the rich, and here we are today. The idea of Trickle down economics has been tried twice in the last 25 years, and both times has led to huge deficits, a recession, and huge government bail outs. You say that the rich would be the ones paying for the majority of our government spending and social programs that the poor use. But, you forgot about the most expensive welfare: Corporate Welfare. To date, the American people have spend $1.3 trillion dollars bailing out the ultra rich CEO's of investment banks, and insurance companies that knew that they would privatize their profits, and socialize their loses. This is just one example of Corporate welfare, it is estimates that US corporations receive over $3 trillion dollars a year in welfare, even companies that don't pay a dime in US corporate taxes. Now, John McCain won't tell you about this welfare, and nor will you EVER hear a republican talk about this, because it doesn't fit their cause. Here is the other problem with your comment, our economy is based on consumption, if the American people stop buying, then our economy will collapse. So, by providing normal Americans with more money, they will send that money right back into the economy, thus spending our way out of this economic crisis created by Trickle Down economics. Do you want the truth about Wal-Mart? I will give you the truth about Lee Scott (the most anti-Ameircan person in the world, and I am sure that when he leaves this earth Sam Walton will be waiting with a baseball bat), this is a man that is the largest supporter of communism in this country, and is the biggest supporter of export American jobs. He has said on TV that all American companies should leave the United States, and move to communist China where they will support a communist government that our own government says is our BIGGEST threat. Mr. Scott believes that Americans should not produce anything that he puts in his stores, and he has sent over $500 million to the communist government of China to make sure that Wal-Mart can explot their cheap labor, and dictate labor laws in the country. Lee Scott, and Wal-Mart will destroy this country, and pave the way for our friends the Chinese to take over our country. Take some time and look at who is buying all of our national debt, and who is starting to buy all of our cheap houses. Our communist friends Russia, and Lee Scotts friends China. This should scare you, but you are a republican, and I am not going to hold my breathe.

The reason the jobs are going over seas is because Bush did not stay proactive and competitive in the global market (I am no Bush fan and his ecomonic plan does not represent most republicans).The rest of world started offering big tax breaks and incentive for companies to come over there. We offered them nothing to stay. So not only did they get huge tax breaks but the employees in those countries would work a lot cheaper. It greatly lowered the companies overhead and meant more profit in their pockets and their stock holders. Yes there are more tax breaks to corporations in this country than for you and me. But they do pay taxes (both fed and state) and they pay more here than they would in other countries, which is why they are leaving. The people in those countries are just as educated and able to do the job as we are but they will work cheaper, plus they save hugely on taxes. It a win win situation for the companies to go there. Heck some of those countries offer to actually pay corporations to come there. Are we offering to pay companies to come here? Then how are we going to compete? We have got to start competing with these countries to create jobs. That means giving them a reason to stay or come here. We have to offer them just a good a deal. I think ending all tax breaks for companies that outsource may backfire on us.I do not think they deserve them but if we do that and do not offer those companies some kind of compensation on the same level as other countries to stay, then they will just pick up and go completely to another country.

Thank you Lloyd for the very thought provoking questions. It amazes me that so many Americans do not make that much money but there are so many people that are willing to pay the way for corporate America. Seems so silly. I have no interest in supporting corporate America anymore than I already do by buying their products. Coporate Welfare is not capitalism! Why don't these people understand this? My father and I supported Hillary, I turned my father into an Obama supporter. My mother was a McCain supporter, I turned her into an Obama supporter. I will be out this week trying to try other McCain supporters into Obama supporters. I wish that I would have supported him from the beginning but, to make up for it LOL I will try to help as much as I can. I fully believe that he is the best person for the job of CIC.

LMAO You are probably one of the fairest people on here. And, I always enjoy your imput. I think that some Republicans and some Democrats are "blinded" by their party and forget that their candidate is doing the same thing that they are bytching about lol.

*tips my hat* Thankee kindly ^_^ I think that's true -- or at least it seems that way to me as well. It seems particularly easy for the whole "MY SIDE is right" thing for alot of people...even when that sort of thinking has no real relevence to the issue (or just actually impossible to accurately ascertain to be relevent). Maybe there's a psychological explaination...but I think it's rather annoying of people, . Some objectivity'd be nice, huh?

Yes extremely!

Bravo! What I would like to know is why don't the conservatives believe in corporate welfare? lol I think the business concept is very hard for a lot of conservatives to understand. You know that concept that you write off everything until your tax liability become almost zero.

Sorry lil I'm not really sure where you got your business degree but the college that I went to for mine and the major that I took had a big international business. With that said Annie is correct. American business' move oveseas because of:tax breaks, cheap labor, cheap materials, no health insurance costs, no safety costs, no unemployment payments, no workers comp payment. I could list much much more but I think you get the point. It goes well beyond tax breaks. And again we have to go back to the fact that 2/3's of American business do not pay federal and a lot of companies pay little state and local taxes due to tax abatements. You are right about our faltering education system. But, yet, ask yourself why do we continue to except our president to be a "C" student or better yet, "5th from the bottom of the class". If we don't demand that our most powerful position is held by a person with an education that is lesser than a lot we can't change it. As long as we live in a society that a "C" is great, we have no reason to fix our education system. We want the best and brightess? Start by electing them, not the ok and dim.

I agree that jobs are leaving for a lot of reasons. Those countries are offering great tax breaks and deals. We are not. There people will work cheaper. It is not just sweat shop jobs that are leaving. Look at india. They have just about taken over the I.T. jobs. Those are good paying jobs. But they can be done from a distance and the labor is cheaper and the people are just as qualified as Americans are. A lot of high technology, high paying jobs are leaving. Why? Because the companies can get a better deal all around by going to those countries. The only way we are going to compete with them is to offer them just a good of a deal. We can not tell other countries what deals they can offer. We can not tell companies where in the world they will have offices and jobs at. Yes we can take away the tax break they get if they outsource their jobs (by the way our federal government is one of the biggest outsourcers), but that is going to cause more jobs and corporations to leave because then the other countries are really offering them a better deal. If the tax breaks we offer is not big enough to offset the money they would save outsourcing than why would they bother? This is one of biggest changes I have noticed in the world. In world war II we were just about the only developed country not bombed to heck and back. So we got the jobs while they rebuild. Well they have recovered and add to that other underdeveloped countries are now catching up with us and we have major competition for corporations. Those countries want jobs for their people just like we do and they are willing to offer incentives to get them. Add to that our education crisis that has been going on for decades. American workers are not longer seen as the smartest, best workers. But we are seen as the most expensive and our government is no longer offering the best deal for the money.

And not only that but $250,000 isn't the same amount of money country wide! How do I figure? Someone making $250,000 in CA is barely scraping by because everything costs more there. Someone making $250,00 in a little city like mine is considered rich, properties aren't worth as much as they would be in NY or CA, money goes a little farther here. So how can everyone be considered making the same amount of money, if the same amount of money doesn't go as far in different parts of the country? STILL doesn't make sense But I still love ya

We shall see.. they all SAY everything they think we want to hear just to get into office.. when either gets elected, only time and congress will tell. Have I asked lately... - - IS IT NOVEMBER. 5TH YET??

Well with all of my work in business and with my degree I would highly recomend anyone in small business making that much in profits to set up an Llc or reinvest in the business. An Llc will protect the owner in many ways and limited liability is probably the biggest. Well an not to mention that Obama said he will stop the capital gains tax on small businesses where as McCain wants to just lower it 7 1/2%. I know I don't have to tell you but 0 tax is better than 7 1/2

LOL I don't think it will either. I just can't believe how many people that aren't making 250,000 is sooooo worried about it.

Hmm...I just checked the website and the tax plan has not changed. "An Obama-Biden administration will provide tax cuts for almost all American families and will not raise any tax rate on families making less than $250,000 a year. This plan will cut taxes for middle class families by three times more than Senator McCain's tax plan. Americans will pay the same tax rates that they paid in 1990s, when President Clinton was in office." I don't think there is anything wrong with being an acheiver in the US. The problem is that we have been on trickle down economics for a very long time (yes 8 years is long) and the midwest is dying.

Maybe you will have to explain how spreading the wealth to the wealthy has helped the US over the last 8 years. Since this Bush has taken office the state I live in has lost over 300,000 manufacturing jobs, gas at one point was triple what it was in the Clinton years, the surplus Clinton left is now a huge deficit, food prices are way up and honestly I could go on. Can you explain where the "better good" is?

I live in Ohio. I understand your position and respect it.

I have to agree completely!