Vermont School Bans Pledge of Allegiance in the class room
By lilwonders
@lilwonders456 (8214)
United States
November 19, 2008 9:13pm CST
Yep you heard me right. If the children want to say the pledge of allegiance they must leave the classroom and go to the gym. As you can imagine it is all over the "God" word. The school says that children should not be forced to say or even hear the words "one nation under God".
The pledge of allegiance has been said in public schools sense 1892. What do you think about this? Is this going a bit too far?
1 person likes this
9 responses
@newtondak (3946)
• United States
20 Nov 08
I think it is going way to far - and once again the rights of one group are taking priority over the rights of another.
In doing a little research, however, I discovered the the original Pledge of Allegiance did not contain the words "under God" and they were not added until 1954: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pledge_of_Allegiance and: http://www.homeofheroes.com/hallofheroes/1st_floor/flag/1bfc_pledge.html
1 person likes this
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
20 Nov 08
Well if a child does not want to say it they do not have to. They can just stay out of it. But to make the other children actually leave and go to the gym to say it is just wrong. It makes it look like the pledge is dirty ,wrong and has to be hidden away from public view.
1 person likes this
@newtondak (3946)
• United States
20 Nov 08
Many schools just say it without the "under God" but to go this far is just ridiculous. It's just another case of abusing the rights of the majority to keep the minority happy.
2 people like this
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
20 Nov 08
Welcome to the peoples republic of Vermont. Home of Bernie Sanders, Howard Dean, Judge Cashman and other notable figures. I live right on the Vermont border, I can litteraly walk/swim to Vermont in under 10 minutes. It's like driving in to a whole other country.
1 person likes this
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
20 Nov 08
Sence when was "God" such a horrible word that they do not want children to even have to hear it. You would think the pledge had profanity in it the way they are acting. But I guess to them "God" is profanity.
When I was young we said it every morning in class. I do not remember anyone ever making a big deal out of it.
We are raising a complete generation that feels no alligance to their own country. They are not taught about the constitution, or the bill of rights. Now they do not say the pledge. This just reminds me of a saying I heard a long time ago "The dumbing down of America". If you do not know the constitution or your rights then you will not complain when they are violated or taken from you.
1 person likes this
@spalladino (17891)
• United States
20 Nov 08
That's ridiculous but I'm not surprised. There's been a movement against Christianity going on for awhile now, meanwhile we pander to the demands of those who follow other religions. There was a problem last Christmas when Wal Mart forbid it's employees to say "Merry Christmas" and, instead, instructed them to say "Happy Holidays". Certain malls refused to put up Christmas trees and, when they finally caved and did, they were called "Holiday" trees. We all need to speak out against things like this or the trend will continue to grow until we don't recognize our own country anymore.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
20 Nov 08
I know what you mean. But as a pervious posted pointed out the orginal pledge did not have "god" in it. It was added in the 50s. Why can't we use that one. We pledge to our country and no one gets offended.
1 person likes this
@mindym (978)
• United States
21 Nov 08
This is RIDICULOUS! I think that if you don't want to say the Pledge of Allegiance, then YOU should go to the gym so you don't have to hear the word "under God". This is makes me FURIOUS!
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
21 Nov 08
Niether should have to go to the gym. If you do not want to say it then don't just stand there. If you do then say it. Think of the time it takes out of learning each day for those kids. The teachers have to stop class. Let the ones who want to say it leave in time to do it. Those kids trek to the second floor gym, wait for everyone else to show up, say the pledge, then go back to class.
Isn't that what school is about. Also the people who do not want their kids to even hear the word "God" then how are the going to learn about the history of this country? You know the whole puritans coming here for religious freedom and all that. The constitution. All that stuff.
@kitttenskysong (676)
• United States
20 Nov 08
i think they did the right thing. Seperation of church and state. Not everyone believes in the same god.
@spalladino (17891)
• United States
20 Nov 08
First of all, you're misinterpreting the Separation of Church and State.
Secondly, the Pledge of Allegiance has nothing to do with religion and doesn't specify one.
1 person likes this
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
20 Nov 08
I agree. It does not say what god. just god. And if a child does not believe in god then they do not have to say it. But the other kids should not have to be hidden like a dirty little secret to say it. Both sides need to be more tolerant. IF you want to say it, then say it , if you dont, then dont.
1 person likes this
@kitttenskysong (676)
• United States
20 Nov 08
i believe in more than one god and goddess some people don't believe in any god at all so why should they be forced to recite a statement that mentions only ONE GOD?It does fall under the seperation of church and state any thing that mentions any god does even if a specific religion is not mentioned.
Besides god's a recent addition to the pledge added in the 1950's. The original pledge read
I pledge allegence to my flag and the republic for which it stands
one nation with liberty and justice for all
Why can't schools use that no god mentioned at all?
@Faye12 (67)
• United States
20 Nov 08
Although I do feel this is getting a little nit picky, I would have to agree, just cause I am a slippery sloap person. The idea of seperating church and state came about many hundreds of years ago because of how Rome was run by the catholic church. Many governments, including our own, chose to adopt this idea to further prevent misuse of power and to fairly represent every citizen, not just the Christians.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
21 Nov 08
But people are not forced to say it. it is a choice.
@greysfreak (1384)
• United States
20 Nov 08
This is a major shocker, well, not really--considering the way the country seems to be moving. But still, I remember doing it all the time in school, and the only complaint I ever had about it was probably because I was still tired and didn't feel like standing up to do it. But that would have been really before I understood the meaning of it.
I definitely don't see any harm of any student taking a few minutes to do that, most of us have, so why isn't it good enough for the next generation? They can talk about separation of church and state all they want, but I really don't see how saying the pledge of allegiance is telling kids what they have to believe in. I said it, and while I have always believed in God, I have only gone to church a few times in my life, I went to Sunday school a little more than that and some bible studies in college, but I am not an organized religion type person, and even I can't find anything negative about the pledge! Then again, I have always had strong morals, and always believed in God--and that for me is stronger than anything else.
I definitely don't think anyone should be forced to believe in something, but saying "one nation under God" isn't forced belief... if someone doesn't believe, then these are no more than words. That being said, I also feel that more children are in a position where they do believe, so why not just tell those 2 or 3 kids that if they don't want to say it to just stand there or even to skip the part about God. Like I said, I don't see harm in saying it, but if their issue is with non-believers having to say that, then they don't have to.
I thought schools were bad when I was in them, well, they seem to be going downhill even more. The more I hear about public schools, the more strongly I feel about home school, I always said if I have kids I wanted to home school them, but at the rate things are going now, it might come down to a safety thing--which I think it already is in some cases. I went through a lot of bad stuff in school, and the teachers and administration did nothing to punish the bullies who made it impossible to peacefully learn--and that was 10 years ago now, since I was last in public school, well--not counting college. I think this pledge issue is just one small symptom of the decline of our schools.
Anyway, this is just something that really bothers me, like I said, my generation said the pledge of allegiance, as did many generations before me, why all the sudden is it unacceptable? To me it says that it's a problem with people, not the words!
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
21 Nov 08
it is a problem with people not words.
Exactly. I could not have said it better.
@grammasnook (1871)
• United States
23 Nov 08
The United States is built of many religions that is our right. Christians tend to believe that this country is all Christians when the fact is most Christians do not live a life as a Christian should be living. Knowing the bible inside and out does not make you a good Christian it is your action towards your fellow man whether they are of same religion or not. If majority always dictated what is right and wrong then lets see what would this world come too? The majority of children would not want schools so should we stop education? Believe what you believe in and teach and carry that on at home.
As for Christmas/Easter there is no way that you can say this is not a religious holiday. As far as the school system is concerned all the holidays that are considered as being religous should be stated as being a winter vacation how you choose to spend it is on you. If Walmart has decided to have employees say Happy Holidays then so be it. They have many different religions walking into the establishment that is spending money. Why should it be assumed that each person believes in Christ? This is why most businesses chooses not to go one way or another with either relgion nor politics. "Smart Move" But this in no way shape or form takes your right to wish people a Merry Christmas out of the work enviroment. When I go and buy a tree I call it a Christmas Tree and I shall not stop calling it that. If I am of Christian faith nobody should be able to dictate what I can and can not display in my business, the same as I would not complain of a Jewish/or any other person putting out thier decorations.
Well I believe someone had said if the allegiance goes all the way back to 1892 then the original should be the one being said and not the revised one from the 1950's.
@murderistic (2278)
• United States
20 Nov 08
I think it is ridiculous. Children should be offered to say the pledge every morning. No one is forcing them to say it or forcing them to say the whole thing. I know I always stood during the pledge but didn't say it, not because I had anything against giving allegiance, but I really don't like the idea of icons and giving icons any acknowledgment (let alone putting my hand over my heart and speaking to it). That is my personal choice, and I had no problem with the school offering the pledge, in fact I didn't even mind standing for it out of respect. People make way too big of a deal over the pledge.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
21 Nov 08
I would agree. And big deal made out of nothing.
It should be offered. Anyone who does not want to say it doesnt have to.