GOP putting forward a resolution against bail outs
By lilwonders
@lilwonders456 (8214)
United States
December 31, 2008 8:58pm CST
Members of the Republican party are putting forward a resolution (to the RNC) putting them on record as against all the bail outs. They are saying that this country is steadily moving toward socialism and that the bank bail outs basically nationalized the banking system. THey are saying what is needed to fix the problem is not bail outs but a commitment from these companies to fiscal responsibility.
THey are also calling on all Republican members of congress to not support any bails out including Obama's public works program. What do you think about this? I have to agree if the companies and people of this country would have been fiscally responsible we never would have been in this current mess. Tell me what you think.
5 people like this
12 responses
@brian_s (570)
• United States
1 Jan 09
I am against any and all bail outs. I am for a truly free market economy, not the pseudo one that we have had for so long now.
I am sick and tired of people saying that we are not moving toward socialism. It's not like there is only one form of socialism. There are many. When the government pays of our services by using our tax dollars, that is socialism. When they bail out anyone, institutions or individuals, that is socialism.
So people need to stop saying that we aren't headed towards socialism, especially with the election of Obama, and just tell the truth-that we have embraced socialism.
I hate socialism, and I hope that other freedom minded people will start to display their mistrust of government and its socialistic slippery slope that it willingly or unwillingly has found itself on.
True capitalism is the best way to go. As Ayn Rand said, "Capitalism demands the best of every man."
This half-way socialism, and stupid monetary policy of artificially propping up prices is idiotic, and it is ruining our country.
Has anyone stopped to think of these things:
-maybe housing prices crashed, because they are not worth what they were being sold for
-maybe stock prices dropped because they were valued way too high
-maybe big companies crash, because a big company is not always synonymous with good company
So if a few Republicans have finally woken up and decided to fight socialism, good for them. But as far as I can see the only good left in the Republican party lies in Ron Paul. Here's to hoping he lives well past 100.
1 person likes this
@kenzie45230 (3560)
• United States
1 Jan 09
You're right. People keep saying we're not leaning towards socialism and that Obama has no intent to inject more socialism. It's odd that people keep saying that, I think.
When you research socialism, you discover that, "Socialists mainly share the belief that capitalism unfairly concentrates power and wealth among a small segment of society that controls capital, creates an unequal society and does not provide equal opportunities for everyone in society to attain such status. Therefore socialists advocate the creation of an egalitarian society, in which wealth and power are distributed more evenly, although there is considerable disagreement among socialists over how, and to what extent this could be achieved."
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
2 Jan 09
IF only they had been listening to Ron Paul all along. Then we would not be in this mess.
I do hope the republican party stands up against socialism. I hope the average american does too. It is going to take all of us to stop it.
@Arkie69 (2156)
• United States
1 Jan 09
Bail outs is the first thing Hoover tried in the early 1930's and they didn't work then and they won't now. The only thing that brought us out of that depression is WWII and the government sponsored work problems. A lot of people in this area went to California and different places and worked in the ship yards and other factories that built the war toys. In this part of the country they had the WPA and the CC Camps. The Government spent tax payers money to put tax payers to work. The way I see it all this money that has already been spent to bail out the Banks and others was wasted. So far it has been about $1T poked down a rat hole. I wish someone had stopped it before it ever started. I still say a lot of that money found it's way back into the pockets of the politicians that approved it.
1 person likes this
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
2 Jan 09
you can better believe it. And that the lobbyist and special interest groups also padded thier wallets to get a hold of the bail out money. This whole thing has been a shady deal all around.
@bobmnu (8157)
• United States
3 Jan 09
The problem with the government works projects is that it is not helping the economy. The government takes money from the people, in taxes, to pay people to build something that will not produce any new wealth, they also take money form private business in the form of borrowing so there is less money for private induastry to produce goods and services for people to spend their new money on. In Russia people had money but nothing to spend it on because everyone was working making things for the government. They had swimming pools, sports complexes, but no food, no consumer goods and very little extras. The government used all the money to put the people to work but there was no money for business to make consumer products. They you tax the people again to pay for the next project. If you let the free market work the business would get money from the investors and use it to make a product that people want and will buy and take the new money and produce more product, employ more people and attract more investors. People have jobs and money to invest and gain wealth and the government get more money in taxes because more people are working.
If you watch the stock market you will see many small companies that are trying to develop and grow and employ people but will not be able to if the government takes all the excess capital to pay people top wages for made u0p work. You will be employed, have money but nothing to spend it on.
@irisheyes (4370)
• United States
4 Jan 09
My state (Pennsylvania) has already started rebuilding its infra structure. We are an old state and many of these pipes and mains have not been relaced since the 1930's. Don't tell the people in Norristown where there has been at least one serious gas main fire or Ardmore were there was a near calamity at a shopping mall when a broken water main threw an iron sewer cover across the sidewalk about swimming pools and luxury items. We are talking about public safety and a nation that is in dire need of new infrastructure.
Also, how about the fact that increasing the number of people with good jobs, increases the tax base. Not to mention the increased business for the folks like Caterpillar and other American companies that produce construction equipment and materials. Maybe you would like to hang around for another ten years until things start to collapse en masse but I'll be happy to see the government create jobs and make the ennvironment safer with a godd and much needed public works project. Because if things don't get updated this way, it will start to happen after untold numbers of disasters.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
4 Jan 09
thank you for posting this. I think most poeple do not understand how hte public works program is NOT going to help us.
@irisheyes (4370)
• United States
3 Jan 09
Unfortunately, the Republicans think that these "commitments" from industry and finance will just enforce themselves without any government oversight whatsoever. Show me ONE time when that has worked and I'll think about it.
What would be so wrong with nationalizing the banking system? They nationalized the postal system and it seems to be serving the American people a good bit better right now than the banking system.
@irisheyes (4370)
• United States
4 Jan 09
Really. Look at the mess we are in because of so called "free enterprise". I think Americans have to start differentiating between "free" and "free for all" because that is what it has come to with big business and big finance. Every time someone even proposes moderate, sensible regulation, the Free enterprise people start a rant about socialism. I do not see where some broader control of the banking system and even nationalization would end our free society. It would put limits and regulations on how much the powerful and greedy can steal from the rest of society and I do not see how that goes against everything we stand for. Frankly, I think Mr Keating & Mr Madoff go against everything America stands for.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
4 Jan 09
nationalizing the banks goes way against free trade and free enterprise. So therefore is against everything this country was founded on.
2 people like this
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
1 Jan 09
This country is heading towards a lot worse than socialism, in my opinion, and the bank bail outs with no accountability or strings of any kind attached sure didn't hlpe matters. I can't disagree that if people would have been fiscally responsible we wouldn't be in the mess we're in but that's their fault (the GOP's) as much as anyone else for deregulating everything and trusting big banking to take care of their own business. I sure wouldn't call Obama's public works proposals "bail outs"; our infrastructure's falling apart at the seems. That water main in Maryland that broke last week was over 60 years old and I heard it's far from the oldest one in that state. There are many older than that in NYC and I heard the mayor say not too long ago they're afraid to turn the water off to patch them because they think that will cause them to break through completely. There are things in this country that need to be fixed or rebuilt completely and I don't think they qualify as "pork" or "bail outs", simply "necessary" because it's been put off too long.
Annie
@bobmnu (8157)
• United States
3 Jan 09
our infra structure in in the shape it is in because local, state and federal governments are using the money for everything but infra structure repair. When the Bridge in Minnesota fell, MN received several millio9n dollars for highway aid, yet they need a special bill to help rebuild the bridge. Why??? Because the high way money, from the gas tax to build and maintain roads and bridges, was being used to build bike trails, shelters for bikers and hikers to rest in, new buses so they could keep the fairs low, a new bus terminal, the old one was still usable, several hundred for light rail that is being under used even though the fairs are almost free at times. In NYC they are using the gas tax to provide Free Ferry service to Statin Island. Maybe we need to make wise use of the money they alread have. Have you seen the list of Public Works Projects form the state and Cities? Manyu of them are for more parks, bike trails, walking paths, people bridges, Not Cars, more mass transit ar reduced prices. They still are not spending the money on repairing and rebuilding the infra structure.
I am all for using the Gas tax for rebuilding the roads and bridges that the cars and trucks use. Let the people who use mass transit pay for that not me and others like me who only see it when I go to the large city and get stuck behind the buse and getting sick from the fumes.
1 person likes this
@Arkie69 (2156)
• United States
2 Jan 09
Hi Annie. I don't know if anyone else agrees with you but I do. I don't call Obama's plan to put people to work a bail out either. I just wish we had the $1T we have already wasted for Obama to use in his program. Putting people to work is the only thing that will get us out of this mess. The only reason we are in this thing in the first place is because the working people had to cut back on their spending. Gasoline and the cost of living going through the roof took so much of our money we had to cut back on other stuff. One domino after the other fell so now our whole economy is going down. I hope Obama can put a bunch of people back to work and be able to run his programs long enough to get things on the mend. I fear Obama is going to have a very rough time of it though.
1 person likes this
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
2 Jan 09
THe independent states should take of that. That is why you pay state taxes for roads, bridges and such. THey were not wise with their money either.
All the way around I see the bail outs as rewarding bad behavior on all levels,from companies to the county, state and federal government. All of them were very fiscally irresponsible and not we are paying for it.....not them.
1 person likes this
@chineseairhead (756)
• China
2 Jan 09
I don't think Bail Outs will move the country to socialism. This will only deal with emergency situations, such as the financial crisis we face today.
For example, the auto industry is the backbone industry of United States. The Big 3 can't break because this will discourage the people all around the world to stick together and fight the financial crisis. They will lose the confidence to do so.
1 person likes this
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
4 Jan 09
Well the big three have already said that a bail out may not stop them from going under only delay it. The big three have viability problems that throwing money at will not solve. So how are these bail outs going to help in the long run?
1 person likes this
@gewcew23 (8007)
• United States
1 Jan 09
About time, I am all for it. The only thing I have to ask is what toke them so long to get a clue. This illogical idea that the national GOP needed to be the Democrat lite party make absolute non sense. If the Democrat party wants to be the party of fiscal irresponsibility then let them, but America needs some one up in Washington that believes in check book monetary policies. The last thing America needs is to parties that believe in spending money that does not exist and government is smarter than the private sector.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
2 Jan 09
unforunately that is exact what we have and I think unless something major happens that is exactly what we are going to continue to have.
1 person likes this
@coffeebreak (17798)
• United States
1 Jan 09
I am against them, simple cause all the bail outs did was change ownership of the bad debts - there still is no income/revenues coming in from them. What difference does it make WHO owns the debt - what matters is if there is a revenue from the debt and the bail outs didn't do that.
Plus and even more disgusting, is the fact that those that caused the bad debts are still getting their high salaries, doing the same things, spending tons of company money for their own luxuarys and comforts and not a single thing has changed since the bail out. The ones that put us in this mess are still running the shows.
@brian_s (570)
• United States
1 Jan 09
To add to this, the money comes from the Federal Reserve (AKA biggest counterfeiter in the world) making more money. And of course when they make more money, there is more money supply, and so the cost for things goes up. And the big institutions get to use it before the price goes up, but when it gets to us, the money we have is worth less (eventually to probably be worthless)!
@kolleenwilson (94)
• United States
4 Jan 09
I guess that to put out a blanket answer to anything these days is irresponsible. I don't believe that we should be bailing out any businesses without tight restrictions on how the money is used and penalties if used incorrectly. The money given should be viewed as loans with the government first in line to be paid back in a timely manner with an adjustable interest rate. I think to point fingers in blame is only going to do that and not solve any of the problems that are rapidly leading this country into financial armegeddon. I hope that future legislatures are ready to work together and develop strategies to address the current challenges. Many of the problems currently are a result of a combination of factors. People wanting more than they can afford; businesses wanting more money that they are earning; and congressional oversite that was missing in action. Another factor that is just as important is the emotional state of the nation. If we all believe we are headed to disaster we will, on the other hand if we believe that we can create viable solutions to address what is happening that is what will happen. It is our choice, our thoughts.
@kenzie45230 (3560)
• United States
1 Jan 09
I think it's about time that companies take responsibility for their actions. If they have bad business practices, they'll lose money or close. That's the way it should be. Executives should certainly not receive any bonuses if the company is losing money. Any idiot can figure that out.
I think the GOP is right. It needs to stop. I read recently that retailers were going to ask for money, since we all didn't buy enough for Christmas. And dozens of cities and counties and states have decided that they need to start asking for more money as well.
It really has to stop. Everyone - from each one of us to companies to local and federal government - needs to figure out how to live on the income we have. Period.
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
3 Jan 09
LOL, how funny is it that the people that started all of these bailouts are now calling them bad. The leader of the republican party told the world that we needed to bail out the finacial industry of the world would come to an end. Republicans have a history of privitizing profitsm, and socializing loses (remember the S & L bail out of the Bush family, and many friends of the Bush's?). This is nothing new at all for republicans. Now they want to try to fool the American people by saying that they don't approve them? I must say that lying is one of the republicans strong points, but the facts are that the leader of the RNC started this, and they all supported him in 2004.
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
5 Jan 09
Lil, when I talk about the leader of the RNC, I am referring to George W. Bush, who is the current leader of the party. I understand how you feel about the bail outs, I understand why they did it, but it was like giving the key to the hen house to a fox, asking him to get more hens, after he ate all of your hens the first time. Some of these banks are banks that got us into this mess in the first place. Now the vast majority of banks that took this money say they don't have to tell the American people what they did with this money, or how they spent it. As a matter of fact, many of these banks used TARP money to buy other banks at low interest rates. This actually hurt the lending industry because there are less banks loaning out money, which was the purpose of this bail out. But, this is nothing new for our government, they hand out money with no strings attached, and then wonder why they did it.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
4 Jan 09
Well I do not think this is something the congress Republicans started. Alot of people in the RNC that are NOT elected officials did not like any of the bail outs. So they are puttig this forward in the party to try and preasure them not to support them. Personally I never agreed with any of the bail outs. We are deeper and debt and nothing is solved. The same thing was tried before the great depression and it did not work then. I guess sense we did not learn from that mistake. So now we are repeating it.
2 people like this
@sunil_008 (1269)
• India
1 Jan 09
well there is currently this kind of situation in every part of the world. though america hitted badly and it affected the whole right world. but i think bail out was necessary. if someone fall in a ditch the first thing is to remove him out of that situation no matter how you do that,then analysize why he fell or what measures should be taken to prevent the future fall outs. similarly bail out was the only alternative at that time for govenment so they did that. they of course the analising part will come and the prevention will be taken. but you see prevention is always better than cure...
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
2 Jan 09
I do not see the bail outs having a postive effect on our ecomony. How have they helped? What have they done but put us deeper in debt?