Bush Admits He Personally Authorized Waterboarding!

@anniepa (27955)
United States
January 12, 2009 7:55pm CST
Here is part of what Bush told Fox News' Brit Hume: "And I'm in the Oval Office and I am told that we have captured Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and the professionals believe he has information necessary to secure the country. So I ask what tools are available for us to find information from him and they gave me a list of tools. And so we got legal opinions before any decision was made." http://www.phxnews.com/fullstory.php?article=66207 Here's more from the above article: Last year, Bush admitted that he was "aware" that his national security team met to discuss KSM's interrogation, but his admission yesterday suggests he had a far more direct role in developing the specific torture tactics used. Ignoring interrogators' claims to the contrary, Bush insisted that his torture program saved American lives. Bush told Hume, "We believe that the information we gained [from KSM] helped save lives on American soil. My question is do you think Bush will be accused of war crimes, if not in this country somewhere else in the world? Do you think he SHOULD be? Annie
2 people like this
10 responses
• United States
13 Jan 09
No. He did what it took to save american lives. Is water boarding nice? Is it good? No. But then 9/11 was not nice either. Neither would it be if it happened again. He had to make some hard decisions (that is what he is paid for) and in the end he decided to do what it took to protect us. What would the citizens of this country think of Bush if we had another attack here on our soil, and then we found out we had in our captivity terrorists who could have given us information to save those lives but we didn't do anything to make them talk? Everyone would be screaming for his head that is what would have happened. What is more important? The terrorist that wants to kill us or the innocent people that their only mistake was getting on a plane or going to work that day. It is not a easy decision, there is no good decision. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
1 person likes this
@Bd200789 (2994)
• United States
13 Jan 09
I agree, Annie. I think they'd say anything just to stop the torture. Plus , I've heard more people have joined Al Quaeda BECAUSE of our policy on torture.
1 person likes this
• United States
14 Jan 09
If we close down Gitmo tomorrow it will not make them stop getting new recruits or stop doing terrorist attacks. Yes they use it for propaganda. What do you think they do to our people when they get them? Water boarding looks like child's play compared to what htey do. When we start beheading their guys with a knife, tape it and then put it on the internet and the news for everyone to see...then we can talk. I personally do not see where htey ahve room to be upset. We treat their people that we ahve a lot better than the ones of ours they have. you can't get people to talk by trying to be their best friend. We are not muslim so they hate us. NO matter how hard we try to be their friend we are the enemy. We are not dealing with rational people. They are religious extremists. Saying please is not going to get htem to give up their secret plans. Unforunately this is a necessary evil.
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
14 Jan 09
We're supposed to be the good guys, the ones that set the example for the rest of the world, the ones for human rights. It would be bad enough to lower ourselves to their level if it worked but it doesn't. Annie
• United States
13 Jan 09
I do not think he should be accused of war crimes. I have absolutely no problem with torture tactics to save American lives. These people had no compunction about taking American lives so if they have information that could be helpful to us in protecting lives then I say get the them to divulge that information by ANY means possible.
1 person likes this
• United States
13 Jan 09
That is why I said by ANY means possible. If that particular method does not work then try something else.
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jan 09
However, if we try torture methods first it's highly unlikely it will do any good to then switch to a "rapport-building" method that is known to be more effective, is it not? Annie
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jan 09
But what about the fact that these methods don't get them to divulge useful or even TRUTHFUL information? Is it acceptable for us to add more fuel to the fire of their hatred, in a sense, putting our troops and other Americans in even more danger? Annie
@bobmnu (8157)
• United States
13 Jan 09
Trying to find a modern definition of Torture is an interesting exercise. It seems that people have fun with the intellectual game of defining torture. In one article an example of Torture was searing some one with a hot rod. However if A had B restrained and A seared B intentionally then it was torture, but if A accidentally seared B then it is not torture. If B consented to A searing it was not torture. If B did not consent but had the means to object or resist it was not torture but if B objected but did not resist it was not torture. By some definitions having a woman question an Arab Man would be torture because he is being forced to endure something that is mentally distressing. Torture used to be any action that was physically damaging a persons being and causing great bodily pain. What is happening is that we are defining torture after the fact and citing some obscure document to prove the point. If you look at the Geneva Convention it defines POW, enemy combatants, and Illegal enemy combatants, yet some choose to consider anyone fighting against the US as a POW ignoring the definition in the Geneva Convention. Take for example the people being held at Gitmo. According to the UN Convention on Torture we can not send any of those people to a country that might endanger their life. According to the Geneva Convention we can not detain POW beyond the end of the war (as defined by a signed peace treaty) then we have to return them to their country of origin. Which do we follow? I do not believe that President Bush authorized torturing prisoners but he did authorize the use of extreme interrogation methods based upon conventional practices at the time, not by the future definition. PS Annie please do not torture me by making me wait too long and causing me undue mental stress in anticipation of a future negative event. (Defined by some as torture)
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@bobmnu (8157)
• United States
14 Jan 09
Soldiers are allowed to use certain techniques when integrating and the CIA is under a different set of rules. Congress wants to apply one standard to both groups even though the law makes a difference. It would be like applying what a person could do to save a life at an accident site and applying that standard to the Doctor in the hospital. The article only reports actions by soldiers and they are not trained to integrate people. Soldiers are governed by one set of rules and international agreements. The CIA is governed by another set of rules and international agreements. What some in Congress want to do is make it more difficult to get information to protect the citizens of this country. Like I said earlier things that make the person feel uncomfortable such as talking to the suspect for more a than a couple of hours would be considered torture. Under their definition testifying before congress would be torture.
1 person likes this
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jan 09
Bob, I'm responding to you immediately after reading your response so I hope I haven't caused you any undue mental stress...lol! You can put me down as being against torture under any circumstances. In truth, water-boarding has been accepted as torture by our government for some time because we've prosecuted people for using this method. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/04/AR2006100402005.html I believe that when Bush authorized the use of water-boarding he knew, or should have known full well it was torture. Annie
@Bd200789 (2994)
• United States
13 Jan 09
I think he should, but I really don't think Obama will do anything about it. He's said several times that we need to "look forward". The way I see it, though, is how can we look forward until we've dealt with the past? We don't want to just ignore it, and leave it where a future president can do the same, and say it was legal because Bush did it.
1 person likes this
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jan 09
I'm not sure if the same thing could or will apply to Bush as to Cheney and Rumsfeld but I've heard several times that if the latter two men travel out of the U.S. they could possibly be charged with war crimes by another country and having someone else do what we should won't make the U.S. look very good. Annie
• United States
17 Jan 09
President-Elect Obama has already done a wonderful thing, which will help me get over the feelings I've had in the last 8 or so years, of being ashamed of America. He absolutely forbids torture in our country or by anyone representing our country, such as soldiers and guards. Finally!
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
21 Jan 09
Finally is right! Oh, how much I'm not going to miss that gang! Annie
@Aingealicia (1905)
• United States
20 Jan 09
Again we are in GitMo, the Government knew exactly what they were doing and what "torture" we were allowing. As in one of my earlier post to you, I am attending a lot of the things going on right now in NYC. Yes the ACLU wishes to bring him up on "war crimes" but I am not sure that will happen. The UN is talking about it and well needless to say those tactics that were used are not supported by that silly little paper from the Geneva Convention. It's ok though, remember Cheney got away with legally shooting someone too... Ainge
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
21 Jan 09
You're right! Not only did he get away with it but the guy he shot apologized to HIM! Annie
@peavey (16936)
• United States
13 Jan 09
So what? Do you know what "waterboarding" is? It's used to train some of our very own elite troups, for heaven's sake. War crime?? You're stretching pretty far there.
@peavey (16936)
• United States
13 Jan 09
Exactly.
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jan 09
It's still considered torture and is against the Geneva Convention. People have been prosecuted for this in the past. Also, when it's being used as training for our troops they KNOW they're not going to actually be drowned which is the purpose of waterboarding, to make one think they're going to drown. Annie
• United States
13 Jan 09
My dad was in the Military for 28 years. He said he has been waterboarded. He said it won't kill you....but it was not a nice experience.
@irisheyes (4370)
• United States
13 Jan 09
I don't think he will be accused of war crimes and if the statements made on here regarding "waterboarding" are true, he probably shouldn't be. Still, I have to admit that the whole idea of torturing prisoners of war is disturbing to me. When did we get to be the bad guys? We're supposed to be the ones who act against torture. I'm very happy that Obama plans to close Gitmo.
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jan 09
I know, some in this post think water-boarding isn't torture and some think it was fine to do whether it is or not. I'm of the belief that it is torture and that it and any other form of torture is WRONG! It's against our policies and our laws in the U.S. to torture or even slightly "mistreat" even serial killers or those who have been convicted of raping and murdering children! Annie
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
13 Jan 09
This isn't really anything new. I knew this a while ago. Either way, waterboarding = torture? I still think it's a stretch.
1 person likes this
@iriscot (1289)
• United States
13 Jan 09
Hi annie, Bush may be accused of war crimes, but nothing will ever come of it. I'm sure a lot of our foreign friends are upset about it though. I think everyone knows that Cheney, Bush and Rummy were aware of what was happening and probably put their stamp on it.
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jan 09
I think they've all admitted to as much now! I think they'd better watch their backs if they go to visit the countries of some of our foreign friends in the future. Annie