Forgiveness..
By tessah
@tessah (6617)
United States
January 16, 2009 6:50am CST
not something im all that good at. im a hard a55.. i know this. im difficult and demanding, short fused and volatile. i expect alot from the people i keep close to me.. but i give what i expect, so i feel my demands arent unfair or that hard to live up to. the excuse handed out of "im only human" irritates me to no end. yeah, im simply human, but *I* try to be better than that, and if i do and most of the time succeed.. others shouldnt have that much difficulty in doing so either, right? im reminded often that im not the norm of society.. and others arent like me.. they dont have the stamina or the control, they dont hold honor and ethics in the same regards as i do and expecting them to be such as myself, will only lead to my own disapointments. i spose there is some truth in that.. others disapoint me quite frequently. getting past those disapointments isnt something im adept with.. and forgiveness for misdeeds, even less. in order for me to forgive and get past.. i need some semblance of understanding into whatever it is thas been done, and i just cant wrap my head around why some choose to lie, use, manipulate, disregard, and just basically treat those they say they care about with less than the utmost care and consideration. im sorry, i didnt mean what i said.. then whyd ya say it? dont you have control over yer own mouth and what comes out of it? im sorry, i didnt mean to hurt you.. then why did you? did you just FORGET that you loved me? how does someone have that slip their minds? alot of things are quite simply very black and white. if the words coming out of yer mouth are a lie.. you are aware that they are.. you make the concious choice to speak them just the same with full knowledge they will hurt the other person at some point in the future.. knowing this, you DID mean to do it! if you get into an argument, and the words spilling from yer mouth arent what you really feel and think but are just spilling for the purpose of cutting another down because you WANT to hurt them.. it IS purposeful! if you care about another.. you dont want to cause them pain.. and if you do, you really dont care. least thats my view.. and i really dont comprehend why others dont share it, and dont take the time and care to not cause those they say the words "i love you" to purposeful pain. i do.. why dont others? i dont FORGET someone is important to me.. i am ever mindful and diligent in showing those few everyday that yes, i indeed love you. doesnt have to be a grand gesture.. simple actions speak volumes. so help me understand the human factor.. which i apparently am lacking. is it really that difficult to be kind and considerate? is it really such a chore to remember that someone means something to you? is it really so very taxing to simply do unto others?
explain it.. make me understand.
2 people like this
10 responses
@gemini_rose (16264)
•
16 Jan 09
Gosh reading that I felt you were speaking words that I have had in my head so much these last few months. I feel the same way as what you have said here and I do not understand how some people can be so uncaring in their actions. I never forget who is important to me and would never ever hurt them in any way with my words or actions it is just such a shame that no one else shows me the same regard especially those supposed to love me the most. I do not understand either.
2 people like this
@MsTickle (25180)
• Australia
18 Jan 09
Gemini, you made me think of my first husband who at times would be so horrible to me. If I tried to stand up for myself he would beat me harder still with his hands as well as his demeaning, humiliating words. I finally realised that he despised me for everything in his life that was "wrong". He was incapable and/or unwilling to take any responsibility for his own unhappiness...or his actions. Everything was my fault and I deserved or asked for what I got. The most important event of my life was when I finally broke free of that mess.
1 person likes this
@ellie333 (21016)
•
16 Jan 09
Hi Tessa, There is another myLotter who after every response puts 'the more people I meet the more I love my dog' which made me laugh when I first saw it but dogs are loyal unlike some human beings eh! Haven't a clue how to explain any of it. I know that I won't change being who I am and have just come to accept that not all around me are as loving or considerate of others. Huggles. Ellie :D
2 people like this
@etravelster (4)
• Canada
16 Jan 09
I agree in the fact that say I love you is not enough sometimes we forgive in some way or try to but there sometimes that hurt for long time before you can actually talk or remember without getting any bad feelings. I am totally agreed on the fact that is difficult to belive that people act in such a way that hurt people and try to fix it with excuses or sometimes you never know the reason it happen to me all my childhood with my mom I never know why she did my childhood so misseble possible. but now difficult to belive but I dont even ask for the reason past cant be change and life is experiences all bad things at the end helps us te be a better person to not do what we dont like other people do to us.
@MsTickle (25180)
• Australia
18 Jan 09
Dear Tess...as well as demanding , short fused, difficult and volatile add censuring and belittling. Being that way towards those you love and who love you hurts! A lot. I know it's the way you are and so I guess do others and so we lick our wounds and hang around...or some of us do. So please don't try and come off as though you don't offend or hurt people.
Now lying is something else. I've never known you to lie...or to create something false and pass it off as fact. Someone who does this is creating a thin line for themselves because if eventually the "facts" are found out to be false then one has to wonder what other untruths have been told.
So yes, if someone is by nature a bit hard and demanding that is a far cry from being kind and considerate...one cannot be both at the same time, not to me anyway...I'm a sensitive, pathetic being. You can say "I'm telling you this for your own good so you wake up to your miserable self" or you can say "I'm telling you this because I love you and I'm your friend trying to help you be the best you can be". Which do you prefer?
Sometimes you have to love others warts an' all.
@MsTickle (25180)
• Australia
18 Jan 09
I've just finished reading the whole discussion including your response to me. I cried then I laughed.
As for forgiveness...I don't know how it works, I have said the words out loud and in my head but the pain does not go away. How does one move on and leave the crap behind...that's what I want to know?
May peace and love be yours more than anything else.
2 people like this
@sparkofinsanity (20471)
• Regina, Saskatchewan
18 Jan 09
Tessah.........of course you and 'that person' will move on and be better people thanks to the effort put into the forgiveness achieved. I believe that from the depth of my soul...which is no longer in tatters by the way. You posted this discussion asking for help in understanding what forgiveness is and how to achieve it.......I really that you now have a much better idea and that is a bright and blessed thing..........
Hi Tickle, all's right with the world now and I can hardly wait for your roses to bloom in the Spring! Hugs.
1 person likes this
@tessah (6617)
• United States
18 Jan 09
thats what im striving towards.. one issue.. the one from here, has been worked through.. settled out, with forgiveness achieved on both sides of the coin so that she and i can move forward, try to rebuild.. and maybe become something better than we were before. stronger.
the others.. the relatives i mentioned.. will be a bit more difficult to attain.. there wont be any answers to questions of why.. there will be no understandings reached. because only one side, mine.. is the only one looking to reach it. if only for the sole purpose of not allowing the power over my existance, to no longer be there.
@sparkofinsanity (20471)
• Regina, Saskatchewan
16 Jan 09
I have read this entire thread, and though the initial reading of this discussion itself, and coming so closely on the heels of your 'blah and such' one, led me (and others) to believe there was an overlap......., I get that you now claim that this discussion is about your relatives and nothing else. Hard to swallow, but I'll let that go.
As you won't come to me, I'm coming to you. I have just gotten off the phone with bella. She has reminded me of PROOF of Meg's existence. We were talking on the phone one day when Meg's came to my house. She HEARD Meg's talking to me while I was talking to bella. My voice cannot be in two places at once. So I suggest that you talk to bella about this. She didn't want to post this herself because she didn't want to be 'told' that she was making this up to back up a friend. She is your friend too and doesn't feel comfortable getting into these last few discussions of yours and being forced to take sides so to speak. So she gave me the go ahead to post this information to you and hopes that you will talk to her.
All I can say is that if you are serious about learning about 'forgiveness' as a concept to apply to all areas of your life, then you will avail yourself of the opportunity to learn some facts that will allow for a healing of your wounds in areas outside those caused by your relatives. Namely me. Peace and Bright Blessings.
1 person likes this
@tessah (6617)
• United States
17 Jan 09
i tried sending you an email.. but youve got me blocked, and pvt messages never work.. so whatever, here ya go...
i would think that even with our difficulties, that you know im not the screaming psychotic closedminded d0uchbag ive been accused of being here the past few days. and i dont expect you to beleive my words here as i havent got anything to back them up yet.. emphasis on yet, because my mirC records every single word uttered while im using the program, and i have alot to sift thru to find the logs that will. when i first was told that i was being taken for a ride by you, bella is the first person i went to in regards to it. i figgered she knew you better than i did, and she was my friend as well.. and she could put me straight. while she didnt confirm and outright say "yes, shes a liar" she didnt deny it either.. what was said was that she didnt know, but wouldnt be surprised if you were. and i fell apart on her.. and others. no i didnt go to you.. i was so frigen angry and hurt i couldnt even look at yer name without going into a frenzy, and i really didnt beleive youd be straight with me anyway with a half a dozen people telling me theyd been decieved themselves or seen you do such to others, and werent a bit surprised by any of it at all. she watched me downward spiral and twist with it hurting, and never said anything to dispute it. until now.. when i asked her about what youve told me. her reasoning "i didnt want to get involved" now you can take this as you wish.. and yeah, i might be at fault for taking ones word over anothers and being led to beleive things you didnt do.. for that i am sorry more than you can even possibly imagine. but beleive me when i say i didnt just go off on some crazy tangent out of the blue.. i had alot of help along the way when i went seeking this "truth" i hold so damned precious. .;sigh;.
1 person likes this
@moonlitmagikchild (22181)
• United States
16 Jan 09
i cant help you understand because i am the same way as you! i dont understand how people can be cruel and inconsiderate to others and i dont lie and i care about everyone and dont understand when people dont return it.. i give respect and demand it and i am also short tempered with ignorance..
im soooooo the wrong person to ask/have answer haha.. maybe some one can clue us in!
1 person likes this
@tessah (6617)
• United States
16 Jan 09
and im told i will die alone because my standards are so unattainable no one will ever be "good enough".
my circle of friends may be small.. i may be seen as the "unpopular one" because i dont have scads of people milling about me. but i can damned well look in the mirror without shame.. and those who ARE around me, i can trust with my life and then some. i am quite content with that..
thanx magik.. you may not think you were capable of answering this question, but you did settle some things within my own mind. i might be within the minority.. but if you, as well as a few others i know of are as well.. theres gotta be more out there someplace.
the forgiveness ability however, is something i would like to gain.. to gain it, i need to understand what lies within the hearts of man.. and thus far.. no one has been able to, or even made the attempt to explain it other than Irish. 
what would be nice.. is if someone who lives this way.. would pop on here, and say "this is WHY i do" but i highly doubt any of my relatives has the intelligence enough to even know how to turn on a computer.. much less use one. 
what would be nice.. is if someone who lives this way.. would pop on here, and say "this is WHY i do" but i highly doubt any of my relatives has the intelligence enough to even know how to turn on a computer.. much less use one. 1 person likes this
@moonlitmagikchild (22181)
• United States
16 Jan 09
i think there are more people that feel how we do but may not have the guts to state it.. i know im open minded with a lot of things but when it comes down to trust, honesty, etc im firm on what i will stand and what i will not tolerate.. some people dont get it but if some one is the type to hurt me or lie to me all the time then im not gonna have anything to do with that person.. i may forgive.. once.. but i never forget and if they are stupid enough to screw me over 2 times forget it..
1 person likes this
@moonlitmagikchild (22181)
• United States
16 Jan 09
but i think we dont have as much drama at least if we dont put up with crap etc.. if we kept crappy people around us all the time then we would have to deal with their bs all the time and its not worth it.. lifes hard enough!
1 person likes this
@Opal26 (17679)
• United States
17 Jan 09
Hey tess~ I too am not very good at forgiving. I don't take
people being hurtful and lying and doing the things that need
forgiving in the first place as necessary. I don't know what
makes some do these things, while others prefer to give of
themselves and will do almost anything to purposely not
cause someone else pain. But, unfortunatly there are those
who don't care or don't think and just do! And then they
think by saying those simple words that it will erase the
pain of the act when it goes much deeper then that and the
words are just not enough. I've been told that I am too hard
on those that do me wrong and that I should be more able
to "forgive", but that is just not me. I can't forget and
that makes it difficult.
1 person likes this
@AnnieOakley1 (5596)
• Canada
17 Jan 09
Ahhhhh, number 13, my favourite.
I, too was led by you, so quickly on the heels of your 'blah and such' to believe this was about the above poster. I believe that was your intention and you are simply disguising it as a discussion about your relatives. But I can't PROVE IT, so I won't press the issue, ok? I will not BERATE YOU, as you have done to others ASSUMING, without proof that something someone else has told you (GOSSIP), is the truth, when in fact the TRUTH was always the truth all along. You just CHOSE who to believe, that's all.
@AnnieOakley1 (5596)
• Canada
17 Jan 09
Darn it, Opal beat me to it. Oh, well.
Anyway, to take your discussion on the note you say it was meant, these are my thoughts..........
You and I are actually alot alike, you know.
I am often labelled the same way that you are. Hard a55, difficult, overly demanding, brutally honest. I have hurt many people over the years unintentionally. I have tried to change for the better. I have tried to become a more socially acceptable person. I didn't learn the social etiquette very well as an only child, so I am now learning the hard way as an adult, something that most take for granted. I will say, interacting here on the lot though, has helped me immensely. But I'm not done growing and learning yet.
One of the reasons that I am still friends with sparks, is very much because of HER ABILITY to forgive. She is generous of heart, money, time, patience. Gawd, it makes me sick sometimes that she has this endless capacity to forgive. SO unlike me.
In fact, Tess, you and I have so much in common we SHOULD be friends. But, as is often the case, too much alike causes problems, clashes. Often, if stubbornness is one of the commonalities then neither will give way and apologize if there is a disagreement.
@kezabelle (2974)
•
16 Jan 09
Ok i didnt read all your post im having a bad day with my eyes and a post with no paragraphs litterally makes me want to cry soooo sorry if i repeat anything you said
How ever i dont think it is easy to forget im not much good at that I ca forgive easily with no problems but forgetting the act I had to forgive is so much harder and can take a long time i think thats just the person I am though i try so hard not to hurt others i find it jhard to forget when they hurt me.
1 person likes this
@JackOLantern (48)
• United States
16 Jan 09
The only thing I can see as being stated wrong in this post is the conscious choice making in lying. With most people, yes, it IS a conscious choice. However, as a child I began to lie compulsively, even about good deeds, so as to be spared the spoon, paddle, whatever my dad happened to have handy. It got to the point where there was no thought whatsoever involved, I would lie instantly and then stick to my lie. It got so bad that my mom could catch me redhanded, and within half an hour I'd have her doubting herself.
However, I did force myself out of said behaviour. I got sick of people not believing me even when I was telling the truth, so I reversed it. Now I'm a compulsive truth-teller. I don't care whether or not it gets me in trouble, no matter how bad. At least I no longer have to worry about people doubting my honesty, and in fact it comes in handy now. People now know I'm trustworthy, and don't ask questions of me they don't want the answer to. Or they come to me for advice, or if something goes wrong and I say it wasn't me, they nod and look for the real culprit. Most of the time now I'll own up to something before being approached about it. Saves a lot of stress, headache, and worry.
As for forgiveness, I forgive often. However, I don't forget. But I do feel people deserve multiple chances, and the amount of which varies for me depending on who the person is and how close to me they are. But due to my change to honesty, I do find it hard to trust people after they've wronged me. If I can force myself to tell the truth to the point where it becomes a habit and in some ways a flaw, people can make the conscious effort to tell the truth and keep someone's trust.
@tessah (6617)
• United States
16 Jan 09
behaviors taken on as a child really cannot be held by the adult.. unless of course as the adult you still choose to continue with them. as an adult, you realized with a logical mind the repercussions of said behaviors (no one trusting yer word, no one beleiving in you, etc) and made the concious choice to change that aspect of yerself.. and did so with great success.
im of the same mindset as you.. that if *I* can, anyone else can as well.. if they so choose. change is hard.. and i think honestly that people are just generally too lazy to make the effort, simply dont give a damn, or think theyre too slick to be caught.. and when they ARE caught.. they fall back on the everready excuse of "im only human", and if you dont accept that as "reasoning" you think yer better than everyone else. saying a person thinks theyre perfect is meant to be an insult.. to stave off yer own self esteem and convictions in what you beleive in and how you conduct yerself. why? my theory, and that of others, is that they dont like the reminder of their own shortcomings. rather than attemptng to change themselves to be better.. they want you to lower yerself to their levels so they dont have to do anything differently.
i commend you for not being a slack, for not being lazy, for taking the time and effort and dealing with the hardships that personal change entails to BE better. welcome to the minority 
@subhakars (932)
• India
17 Jan 09
todays world runs on money and a lot of other things but sadly love has lost its priority. many tend to use it just to use or influence others. but at the same time time you have to take note that everyone is not like that. it is just that we meet the wrong people and mistake them to be THE right person. life does not stop for anyone. first stop expecting things from others as it might hurt you more. try and forgive and forget. hard but try
