Today there was a substitute teacher in my son's class. She didn't have a clue

@mommaj (23112)
United States
July 29, 2009 1:23pm CST
Today there was a substitute teacher in my son's "special" class. She didn't have a clue about handicapped children. Most of the kids are autistic. They all vary in mental age range. What was interesting was she told them to get their chairs and sit down. No one moved. No one even looked at her. She was dumbfounded. The aide got the chairs like usual and set them out. Thank God she was there today. The regular teacher was out. The aide really saved the day. Do they let substitutes that aren't qualified sub at your schools? I don't ask for much but if they can't get a sub that at least knows about handicaps get a parent of a former student. That was ridiculous.
8 people like this
24 responses
• United States
30 Jul 09
The only requirement for subs in my state is that they be highschool graduates and over 18 for the lower grades and then a 2 year college degree or equivilant amount of hours and 21 for the upper grades. I agree that there should be more qualifications for students with special needs but to be honest in schools where the special needs students are mainstreamed the majority of the teachers are not qualifies to help your son. I graduate in December to teach and I have only had one class that covered students with special needs. I do not feel that I am in anyway qualified, but if I get a job in a school with full inclusion (where all students are in all classes) I will have to learn by on the job training. Special Education teachers are amazing and have a heart for their work, but it is not a job for everybody. Please keep this in mind if and when your child is put into a mainstream classroom; and never hesitate to educate your child's teacher, I personally would be thankful for the expert advice.
1 person likes this
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
If you enjoy kids then you can teach handicap kids even if they are in your classroom. If a child is mainstreamed the child is capable of being treated the same as the other students, I would hope. If you are a parent then you already know how to deal with special needs students. Kids are kids and they should be treated as such. With special needs students, you treat them at the age level they are mentally NOT PHYSICALLY. This lady came in there and saw 4-5 year olds and didn't know that none of them were mentally four or five. I think you will be fine as a teacher especially if you treat the kids at the level they are at. If a special needs kid is in your class that means he or she is mentally at that grade level. You may have to work with them because they are slower but you may have to work with the other kids that don't pick up as fast. Good luck. I am sure you will see what I mean. You may not even know one of the kids is special needs unless you are told.
1 person likes this
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
That's good and bad on all kinds of levels. I guess if I was there my child would be home schooled! If the grade difference is that obvious you will know what you are dealing with fairly quickly. I'm not sure I like that idea. Why couldn't a 12 yr old be in with a five year old? Their mentallity would be the same. It's the people that see it that cause the problem. What a shame!
1 person likes this
• United States
30 Jul 09
Actually here (in TX) they do not place special need students in mainstream classes acording to ability. There is the posibility that I will be teaching a 6th grade class with a special needs student who is only cabable of 2nd grade work. They do this so that there are not 12 year olds in a class with 5 year olds. They place by age here. But you are right in that I will do everything I can to make all of my students feel welcome and capable in my classroom, because that means that I callenge them in a way that they are able to respond to and succeed in. Have a great day!!
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85146)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Jul 09
My son's in a regular class, so no doubt they have subs who don't know much about autism. I would hope they wouldn't have those people sub over in the resource room though.
1 person likes this
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
29 Jul 09
This was the resource room. The handicap class that is mostly autistic. They are all on different mental levels. One child is a little further behind mine but for the most part, most of the class doesn't speak. They don't communicate with words, some of them don't even point yet.
2 people like this
@dawnald (85146)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Jul 09
That's just not right. If they couldn't get a special ed person to sub, they should have pulled in the principal or anybody who had a clue.
1 person likes this
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
29 Jul 09
I don't see why they didn't ask a former student's mom to help for the day. They don't want current moms in there and I can agree with that but I think they should have someone in there that is used to children. I call it simple parenting, now they need to do some simple teaching. That's always harder than parenting.
1 person likes this
@Foxxee (3651)
• United States
30 Jul 09
My goodness... you seem to be having a lot of problems with this school... I think you need to go over their heads... I bet its frustrating... I would of hit the fan by now. I'm not saying its the substitutes fault, but the systems it sure is. How dare they think they can get away with things like this... I guess they feel its no big deal, our kids can't go home & tell mommy & daddy that the new teacher did everything wrong... Hmmm.. Glad the aid was there to help though... They should really inform these subs about the situations...
1 person likes this
@Foxxee (3651)
• United States
31 Jul 09
LOL! That is me & you also never know when I might just pop on in without notice. :D
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
They don't have to worry about mine telling me. I find out because I stick around alittle in the class room when I drop him off.
@dreamr802 (985)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Substitute teachers only need to have any type of college degree. My friends sub as a way to get some extra money. But I doubt if the aide wasn't there they wouldn't let someone unqualified be in that classroom with handicapped children, at least I hope they wouldn't otherwise that would be very irresponsible of the school system.
@Foxxee (3651)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Well I guess its different all over. I know here a sub has to have some kind of training & knowledge with children who have disabilities before stepping in a special educational classroom. But with that said, this only plays part if the sub is taking over the spot of the main teacher. If the main teacher will still be there that day, then it can be any sub with or without knowledge take over for an aid, but an aid only.
• United States
30 Jul 09
I do agree that subs should have more training but in the state of Connecticut they only need a college education.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Wow foxxee, we don't even get that! The aide can definitely do the teacher's job but any sub they put in there doesn't have to be qualified.
@irishidid (8687)
• United States
30 Jul 09
You and I know how eccentric these kids can be at times. I don't think enough SPED teachers are being instructed on the mannerisms of autistic children. I have a feeling this substitute went into the classroom with absolutely no preparation. Sometimes even the ones who work with these kids are just as clueless. I've seen it time and time again when my daughter was in elementary school. It's frustrating having to continually get calls because the staff did something they have been told over and over not to do.
1 person likes this
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
That would really peeve me. Tell someone not to do something and they do it anyway! I realize that you can't keep track of every child but some kids should stick out in your mind, especially the ones that need help! You can't touch them and then if they are the ones that like being touched they won't touch you back. Then you have ones when they get upset they will start banging their heads. Of course, you got ones that spin and can be just as frustrating as the head banging. There are so many ins and outs with these kids that if a school offers the classes to handicapped students they have to be willing to be prepared for them. There is no excuse for them to say okay you can come here but you have to be normal. That doesn't fly with me! They need the teachers to be prepared or they are going to have all kinds of meltdowns on their hands.
1 person likes this
30 Jul 09
As a teacher, I think this person was obviously put in a difficult position. In the UK, u dont need special training to work with special needs children. A parent cannot legally take a class. Just because they have experience with one child, doesnt mean they can manage a class, its a totally different experience. She should have been left vague instructions as to what the childrens routine is as SEN children in particular do not like changes to routine. If you were put in a different role at work with no experience and no guidance, do you think it would take you a little while to settle in?
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Is that fair to Children who have a hard time adjusting to change? She had instructions, the aide who is a qualified teacher was there. All she had to do was help the children. Almost like a babysitter. You follow the aides lead. The aide says it's time to sit down and grabs a couple of chairs. You don't tell the kids to get chairs. If the aide is getting them HELP HER!
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
The teacher was absent, The aide ran the class. They put a substitute in to help the aide because you need to bodies in the classroom. Substitutes do not need any education of any type to be a substitute. You have to pass a background check and that is all.
30 Jul 09
I thought u meant and aide was a teachers assistant, thats what we have here. Do you think that she was maybe nervous with people watching her? Maybe she had a hiccup at the start of the day, its not easy going into a new class with new children, ive done it before. Like everything, some people are better at their jobs than others. In the UK, if my aide is off, I dont get another one, I have to manage the class on my own.
@sid556 (30960)
• United States
30 Jul 09
I agree with you very much but the problem is that "aides" can be anyone...they can be parents. A substitute can not be a parent or a volunteer. The substitute actually has to have the credentials to be a teacher. Unfortunately most teachers do not excel in most fields. How often a history teacher will be substituted by an english teacher and maybe even a gym teacher. I am sure the school tries first the teachers most qualified for the particular class. It is better than no one at all and luckily you have aides. back in my day...we did not have aides. If a teacher was out..we were stuck with whoever we got....teacher almost NEVER knew what we were working on and pretty much just took over the class for a day...it is just a day. She is not affecting the child's life long term...she just took over for a day. It doesn't happen often that a sub takes over a class...I'd just let it go and not worry about it. If she were much more qualified....she would not be a sub.
@Foxxee (3651)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Actually... teachers aids have to be trained here at my sons school. A teachers aid just cant be anyone. Not here anyway. Also a sub can't teach in my childs classroom (who has Autism)unless she has some kind of training for kids with disabilities, but thats if the main teacher is out, but it seems every school has their flaws or the state has different laws on things like this. All I know is all 3 teachers in my sons classroom are very much trained & have plenty of knowledge.
@sid556 (30960)
• United States
30 Jul 09
oh. I see. Here the aides are usually parents that want to work in the school. Some are students that are still working on getting their degree. If the aides are qualified to take over the classroom, then that would seem to be the better choice and especially when dealing with special needs children.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Sid, here the aides are well trained and quite educated. They can be teachers, at least in the disabled classrooms, they have reg. teachers as aides. In this area, the substitutes are not teachers. They have no teaching credentials. Most of them are parents or just need a temp. job. You only have to pass a background check to be a substitute. If you have college background, not a degree just college, you get paid more than a substitute that only has a high school education. The subs are not qualified to teach, nor are they qualified to help special needs children. I was thankful the aide was there.
@daeckardt (6237)
• United States
30 Jul 09
I think that they will let anyone who is willing to sub and meets the minimum requirements set by the district sub. I know the only requirement at my district is that you completed 60 credits of college. They also have you fill out a questionnaire to see what your skills and abilities are and I don't remember what else I had to fill out. They also wanted three references. I finally got the last one done recently. I was not able to sub last year because I didn't have the references. When I subbed as a teacher's aid many years ago, I preferred the special ed classes because I had difficulty dealing with the larger classes. I agree that it was ridiculous that the sub knew nothing of handicaps. I would hope that I am given at least some basic information about my students if they do allow me to sub in the schools. Thanks for bringing up the topic.
@daeckardt (6237)
• United States
30 Jul 09
I don't know where you are at, but I think you should contact the board of education and let them know about this and that they should require at least some college education. I can't picture allowing someone to enter a classroom as a substitute teacher without at least a minimum amount of education. That is totally scary. I have done a lot of outside reading (unrelated to school) while I was a student because I was told some things about myself that would help me to better understand what these students are going through. I hope that they tighten up the requirements for substitute teaching where you are at. At the very least, I hope that you filed a complaint against that teacher and suggest that she not be allowed to substitute in a special ed class again. Have a great day!!!
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
1 Aug 09
Actually, I said something to the teacher about her sub and she told me, she has three kids of her own. The difference is none of her kids are disabled and some people grow with their kids and they forget the different ages. I grew up babysitting so I was aware of the stages before I even had children. Personally, if I taught it would be in a daycare because, although my children are older, I love infants. But, most people grow out of the "baby stages" as their children grow.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Here, you don't even need college. I don't mind if they are in regular classes without a clue. There is only so much that can mess up a little kid's mind. Normal children will usually just laugh at the sub. Special ed. children don't get the benefit of talking and thus shouldn't be thrown to the wolves. My child didn't eat or drink at school and he usually drinks. Was he upset? I don't know for sure. All I know is what I saw of her and what she told me. Special ed classes should have someone in them that can handle any type of situation that might come up. If you can't figure out the kids don't understand or know how to get chairs out to set on will you figure out if one is getting ready to have a melt down?
1 person likes this
@Wizzywig (7847)
30 Jul 09
I have worked as a substitute teacher - but we call them supply teachers here. I dont know how it works elsewhere but you cannot be a supply teacher without a teaching qualification, membership of the GTC (General Teaching Council) and an enhanced CRB (criminal records bureau) disclosure. You have to be cleared by this process to be allowed to work with children or vulnerable adults. Some of my assignments were through an agency who would match the requirements of each assignment to the qualifications and experience of the teacher. In your case, I would say that the school,- in particular the person with reponsibility for placing substitutes - was at fault. I imagine the subs desperation to get work there was matched by the school's desperation to find cover. There is an increasing tendency for the classroom assistant to be given responsibility for the class if the regular teacher is missing here in England. This is a far cheaper option for the school but IMO is an exploitation of the assistant by giving him/her the responsibility of a sub teacher for about half the pay.
@Wizzywig (7847)
30 Jul 09
the rate of pay as a sub teacher is almost double that of a sub assistant. I have worked in Special Needs schools on supply, but would only accept assignments in the role of assistant as I dont feel that I have sufficient experience.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
The aides here get more pay than any sub. As far as being a sub. you just have to pass a background check. Hopefully, she passed. LOL Teaching special needs children is a challenge but they have structure there and the teacher and aide are great. When they have to be out, it's a problem.
@ucue2008 (924)
• Malaysia
21 Aug 09
Sometimes, I do encounter this kind of situation. The school management has to choose somebody to replace the regular teacher, and as it seem harder to find the teacher with the same qualification, so they pick anyone that they can find whether that person really qualified or not. Moreover she knew, and she will learn as time goes by. We need to give a chance to people.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
21 Aug 09
It's unfortunate to say, but you don't give a chance to people at the risk of a child. We aren't talking a regular classroom where the children talk. These are special ed. children. Most of them don't speak. Noone knows what goes on in the classroom but those kids and they aren't talking. Do you really want to do that to your children. I wouldn't mind giving the lady a chance in the regular classes. The kids could tell you what happened. I was glad the aide was there, but someone had to leave the room with half the children at lunch. Whether my child was with the sub or the aide, I don't know. I know he didn't drink anything which was unusual so was he upset? I don't know.
@scheng1 (24649)
• Singapore
30 Jul 09
I ever tried to be a relief teacher for just a day, and that was the most horrible day! It was just after the examination, and the regular teacher was sick or something, anyway absence from work, no aide or assistant around. I couldn't ask the students to do their homework, since it's just after examination, and they did not have any homework to do. I had no teaching tool either to entertain them. So just ask them to keep quiet, stare hard at the noisiest kid and let them did whatever they want.
@scheng1 (24649)
• Singapore
30 Jul 09
haha, Mommaj, if you are in my class, I will ask you to catch tadpoles, so that you will not face commas problem again. Whenever you run out of commas, you can use a tadpole to substitute for a comma. In this case, your punctation problem is solved, until you run out of both commas, and tadpoles, then you have to catch some more.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
HAHAHA. I want you as my teacher. We would have thrown paper at you, and snuck off. That sounds like a horrible thing to do to a sub. Here, there are class assignments and the day is planned out on a teacher calendar so a sub will know what needs to be done. It's funny that I even know that, my best friend is a teacher and she told me they put their schedules where anyone could find them just in case there's an emergency.
@Canellita (12029)
• United States
31 Jul 09
The absent teacher should have left a lesson plan for you to follow or some handouts for the students to do.
@Canellita (12029)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Honey, if everyone were qualified they wouldn't have to call it "Special" Ed. Just be grateful she wasn't mean and impatient.
@Foxxee (3651)
• United States
31 Jul 09
Canellita, your right, I'm sure in most states & in some schools this is how it works. They do have subs just for the special needs classrooms & substitute teachers who work in special education settings have the opportunity to improve the lives of children with disabilities. With the "no child left behind laws" teachers all have to be highly qualified for their area, so schools are becoming more concerned about who subs where. So maybe things will change ALL-over. I believe if the main teacher that works with special needs childrens is going to be out, then they should use a sub that actually has worked & is trained to care for our children with special needs. They have special needs subs for a reason, use em.
1 person likes this
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
I was just disgusted she wasn't capable of dealing with those kids. I think every child is special these are just on a different age range. I guess as your kids get older you forget how to deal with younger children. You just expect certain things.
1 person likes this
@Canellita (12029)
• United States
30 Jul 09
You have to remember that substitute teachers do not necessarily have a degree in education. They may not have any kind of degree at all otherwise they would be out working more regular jobs with better pay. Substitute teaching is a job for people who are available during the day and often at a moment's notice. Think about it.
• United States
10 Aug 09
I remember a few of my ignorant teachers. One suspended a id with turettes for cursing. He gave me detention for telling him he didn't know a thing when he stated that autism and aspergers were both fake and that everyone with either condition was just a brat who didn't get punished enough as a kid.
@Foxxee (3651)
• United States
13 Aug 09
Sounds like that ignorant radio host guy named Michael Savage or some crap. He also stated Autism was just a brat child. But that just shows you how much ignorance is out there.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
10 Aug 09
Oh my gosh! I hope the teacher got kicked out of your school and wasn't allowed to sub there anymore. I know a lot of people who think like that and it is sad they don't understand it is a medical condition and not "brattiness". My mother gave me good advice, on more that one occasion, but she said never to let anyone walk on you and don't walk on anyone else. I try to heed the advice because I am very head strong. I am glad you stood up for yourself and your classmates. Some people are just jerks.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
16 Aug 09
Oh, that's right! I completely forgot about him.
@windymyre (210)
• United States
30 Jul 09
There is a substitute teacher here that receives services from the community mental health department. This is something that I've know about for years from when I worked at an answering service. Because of confidentiality reasons, I couldn't say anything. I had always wondered how she became a teacher. It was just in the newspaper recently. This woman has to go to the health department every day to receive her medication. She is not capable of giving herself her meds, but she can teach our children? They say that because of restrictions all the school system can do is run a criminal background check. She isn't a criminal, she just isn't mentally stable.
• Canada
30 Jul 09
Wow!!! That's unbelieveable. It's enough to make me think that homeschooling kids would be a good idea. I can't believe that it's legal for this woman to teach children. Wow!
• Canada
30 Jul 09
Wow!!! That's unbelieveable. It's enough to make me think that homeschooling kids would be a good idea. I can't believe that it's legal for this woman to teach children. Wow!
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
I would think they would have to have other checks on her and if she isn't mentally stable and that's what the meds are for, the school wouldn't have hired her. If she is taking meds for diabetes or thick blood where she would have to give herself a shot or be monitored, I could see why they hired her. How did she get so far?
@horsesrule (1957)
• United States
16 Aug 09
Wow, I find that sort of scary. You are right, thank goodness for the aide. Think of how much damage the substitute could have done with the kids. My youngest grandson (I live with them) would not be able to get into a chair if a stranger told him too. He might do it if I or his mom told him but even that's pushing it. I am amazed the school would put an unqualified substitute into a special needs class.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
16 Aug 09
I completely understand what you mean. My son usually doesn't "hear" anyone. He is almost completely in his own world. You really have to be animated with him unless he is used to you. I completely understand about your grandson. I have no idea why they put this woman in his classroom. I think since she's a sub and a mom that she could handle it. I don't think they told her most of the kids were on a two year old level.
@KupoSin (680)
• United States
30 Jul 09
well this kinda applies to even the "regular" kids. substitutes in general dont really understand the need of the kids. i reemmber when iw as at school and every time we had a substitute they were really just there to babysit us for the day. they didnt know what they were talking aobut, all they did was sit at their desk and waste our time. i could image how bad it was for the special classes to have an unqualified substitute. if you are really furious, you should contact the school that he is attending. school can deal with mad kids, but they cant deal with mad parents. so stand up for a better substitute.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
I did that this morning. The reply was, well she has three kids. Since when does having kids even make you a good parent much less a good choice for a substitute?
• United States
9 Aug 09
I remember when I was a T.A in high school for the special ed, we had a week long substitute when the teacher went on her honeymoon. The Sub was a speech therapist, so she had an edge, but there were seve wzral "problem childs" that sent her into a nervous frenzy, like your son's class, she had never dealt with anyone with autism before either, there was one point where one of the boys with Autsim was having a melt down and she went to him and said "oh its okay" and put her hand on his shoulder, just as a nice gesture and trying to calm him, she knew no better and that works sometimes with DS kids, but the boy FREAKED out, and it just made her nervousness skyrocket, and all the kids could sense it, and thus, that made them nervous.................it was fortunate that there were aides, teaching assitants (like me :)) and other teachers to help her out and show her how to do things.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
9 Aug 09
Those kids are so sensitive to emotions and it does make them worse. I am glad she had someone there with her. She shouldn't have been put in charge of the class though, being a sub and unfamiliar with the children's characteristics. I did actually say something to the teacher about it, she just said the woman has three kids. Having children certainly doesn't make you a good parent, much less a good substitute.
@Hatley (163776)
• Garden Grove, California
3 Aug 09
the substitute should have been someone who knew about the various handicapped kids and knew how to handle them. I have been out of this loop for years but hope that other substitute teachers are not as clueless as the one you described.these kids need all the help and encouragement they can get. they must know what they are dealing with.
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
4 Aug 09
I believe it must have been out of desperation. It could have just been the fact that someone felt obligated to put her in the class. I would say it was a bad judgement call on the part of the principal.
@tundeemma (894)
• South Africa
30 Jul 09
that was a really bad idea, i think the former teacher should have lecture the new teacher of the ways she had been handling the class maybe he would not have problems dealing with the students, but all the same i do believe that with time your son and other students will get use to the new teacher
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
30 Jul 09
Oh, no. Thank God she is not the new teacher. She was just sub-ing. The teacher is back today. Hopefully my son will be better.
• United States
1 Aug 09
That is pretty unfortunate. I wonder if they even explained to her about the class. There is a shortage of teachers out there, and subs (I should know, two of my classes in high school had regular subs and they were both the football coaches who had no actual degrees for teaching classes or the subjects they were subbing). So maybe it was a mishap, but I do think that it was lucky the aide was there. She may have bee dumbfounded because, well most times you can't really set apart the kids with autism from normal kids at a first look. Sometimes kids with autism, when the parents don't know, go to school and end up deemed troubled or troublesome, because no one realizes they have autism, and it can be hard without knowing about autism, or any clues as to what to look for, and I doubt many teachers are taught that, and maybe they just figured they could throw anyone in there. I don't know, do they have certain rules or regulations about the qualifications for someone to be able to teach the differently abled students?
@mommaj (23112)
• United States
1 Aug 09
There is a whole other rule book with restrictions and guidelines for a disabled class. There is supposed to be someone in there at all times that can handle the children. I know at lunch time someone took part of the class to the cafeteria. But, there are rules and qualifications for disabled students classes.
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