Do you support the constitution?
@thegreatdebater (7316)
United States
October 12, 2009 6:39pm CST
I was flipping channels today on my radio, and I came across a guy on Patroit radio (note the irony) talking about voting. He was trying to justify his thought process of only allowing people to vote if they pay taxes. The funny part was when he realized that many of his listeners did pay taxes, he started to allow for exceptions. If you support this idea, then doesn't that mean that you don't support the constitution? And, why shouldn't I be allowed to vote because I am married, have three kids, and don't make over $60,000 a year?
1 person likes this
12 responses
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
13 Oct 09
Wow, who was the guy? I don't know what that has to do with the constitution though. Not really a lot of information to go on here GD', could you give the guys name and what part of the constitution he was citing to make his justification? Or was the constitution your addition?
Either way, it's a rediculous notion what ever he was using to justify it.
2 people like this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
14 Oct 09
X, the guys name is Andrew Wilkow. What he wants to do is change the constitution so that you have to pass a test to vote. I was amazed at how fast he started to allow exceptions when he realized that his idea wasn't working out like he thought it would.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
13 Oct 09
I did not hear it.But then I don't usually listen to it. GOt too many other things to do. Was he saying people should not be allowed to vote if they don't pay taxes or if they do?
I have heard before the idea of not allowing people who do not make enough to pay federal taxes each year the right to vote. Why? Because it is not their money being spent to support and pay for our government and its programs.
Or people on welfare. Because they are taking out of they system instead of paying into it. It is really easy to say ya lets have higher taxes if you know it won't effect you and your wallet.
I see there point....but I think it is stupid. Everyone should have the right to vote. Well anyone 18 years of age and older.....and a LEGAL citizen of this country.
1 person likes this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
13 Oct 09
This doesn't happen that often, but I agree with you.
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
14 Oct 09
The sad part is that they do agree with each other alot. They just don't want us to know about it so both sides can control us.
@lilwonders456 (8214)
• United States
13 Oct 09
wow....the great debater agrees with me on something....wow. I am just about speechless.
See conservative and liberals can agree on some things.
Now we need to tell the guys and gals in washington.
2 people like this
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
13 Oct 09
Could you give the name and either a clip of what he said or at least a transcript? It sounds too ridiculous to believe without hearing it for myself. Pretty much anyone who spends money at least pays sales tax (although you can write that off in many states).
1 person likes this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
14 Oct 09
The guys name is Andrew Wilkow, he is on between noon and 3pm on patriot radio on sirius. I don't have a clip of this, but you might be able to find it on the web. We have all heard people suggest simular ideas to this, but this is the first time I have ever heard people bring up the fact that many Americans that support these idiots wouldn't be allowed to vote either.
@dawnald (85146)
• Shingle Springs, California
13 Oct 09
I wouldn't say this doesn't mean you don't support the constitution. After all, at one time only white, male landowners were allowed to vote. So proposing a modification isn't automatically against the constitution. But hey, resident aliens pay taxes. Should they get to vote? I don't think so....
But I find the it hilarious, where he started to change what he was saying based on his audience.
1 person likes this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
13 Oct 09
I do like the point you make that resident aliens pay taxes, I wonder if he would allow them to vote? I just think that people who want to change the constitution so a very small amount of people can vote, don't realize how many people would be excluded from voting.
1 person likes this
@matersfish (6306)
• United States
13 Oct 09
I've always said that people should have to pass a test (perhaps the equivalent of the citizenship test) before they're allowed to vote.
Not for nothing, but I don't trust someone who thinks Ben Franklin was America's greatest President to help decide my children's future in the country.
But I usually only think this when the elections don't go my way.
I'm selfish and greedy!
1 person likes this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
13 Oct 09
I thought you would be more worried about the people that vote Mickey Mouse for president. I don't think that many people would be able to vote, and it might surprise you who wouldn't be able to. Very interesting.
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
13 Oct 09
You must know that we can NEVER make people pass ANY test to be able to vote. You can blame Jim Crowe and the morons in the south for ruining that by using bogus literacy tests to stop black people from voting. As much as I'd love to force people to be educated before they vote, that's been permanently ruined in a way that we can't risk repeating.
@Koriana (302)
• United States
13 Oct 09
The next thing would be the great argument over weather or not someone pays taxes..
at least, I've had a few on forums over weather I do or not (believe me, I do, we even had to pay a service charge to get the IRS to allow us monthly installments!)
Everyone pays some taxes!
1 person likes this
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
14 Oct 09
You are correct that everyone pays taxes. Just try to get people to see that.
@bobmnu (8157)
• United States
13 Oct 09
Taking his point of view I ask this question - Why should a person who pays no taxes be able to vote to increase taxes so that they can receive more? The worst point in a Democracy is when those who depend upon the government for their living become the majority.
If you take 100 working people and ask them if they would support increasing the the Social Security payments and the tax also. Most would vote no. Now bring in 55 people receiving SS and 45 people who do not receive SS but pay the tax and ask the same question then take the vote. It would pass. Why? Because most people will support something that will benefit them without cost to them.
You see this in "tax the rich" philosophy. How many people rejoiced when the bonuses were denied the executives?
If you are not paying but only benefit from the spending you will support the spending. Or you will vote for those who will give you the most money without any cost to you.
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
14 Oct 09
Bob, I understand what you are saying, but using your logic, shouldn't the men and women in the military decide if they should go to war instead of congress and the president. Congress and the president have no skin in the game, their decision isn't going to effect their lives. I understand that logic being used, the problem is that All Americans pay taxes. Why should I lose my right to vote because I am married, have kids, and don't make over $60,000 a year?
You say that we live in a "tax the rich" country, but isn't our tax laws based on religion? Why is it that my taxes went down when I got married?
I have said many times that a flat tax wouldn't be a bad thing, but more and more wealthy Americans don't want any part of this because it would be much harder to hide their income. You asked the question: "How many people rejoiced when the bonuses were denied the executives". The answer to that is simple: Many of these people caused the worse financial crisis this world has ever seen, and it cost us over a trillion dollars to fix. The question I have for you is: Why did so many Americans go crazy when the IRS, and RBS came to an agreement to release the records of Americans who were hiding billions in secret accounts off shore? Do you think they were evading taxes???
@cotton0821 (259)
• United States
13 Oct 09
The idea of being allowed to vote based on personal wealth was done away with many years ago. As it should have been. However, I do think that there does need to be some tightening up of the voting rules. People who owe back taxes should not be allowed to vote. People who are behind on their child support should not be allowed to vote. I think the voter registration card should be considered a very precious document and not be given to just anyone. This criteria should not be wealth but rather a person is a good citizen.
@Bliu911 (22)
• United States
13 Oct 09
"People who owe back taxes..." MANY voters don't believe that the taxes levied against citizens are justified, and therefore they don't pay them as a political statement, or in an effort to change laws regarding them. Some of these people are the most educated voters in the nation. They should not have a right to vote, in an effort to get someone in office who will change the laws regarding taxes?
"People who are behind on their child support..." My husband was ordered to pay support for a child whose mother kept the child from him for eighteen months. She literally took their child (at age 6mos) and kept him from my husband for the next eighteen months.
He had to pay BACK child support, as well as pay the STATE back for the welfare my stepson's mom received while she had him. While my husband paid support and back support for his son for years, his son's mother literally did NOTHING for him, and sat on welfare collecting my husband's paycheck. My husband was able to successfully gain custody of my stepson because of my stepson's mom's failure to parent their child. SHE is not required to pay support, however, because in the eyes of the court, it could be "detrimental to her relationship with her son" if she is required to do so.
So, she should have been able to vote, while collecting welfare and paying no taxes - but my husband, who was in arrears over $6,000 upon the signing of the first order to pay support (which HE went to court to arrange), should not have had the right to vote, because he "owed" the mom money?
The voter registration card IS a very important document, and that is exactly why it should be available freely to anyone who understands its importance. I would say that anyone who bothers to take the time to sign up for one (they don't just automatically mail them to you at age 18, like they do draft registration cards, you know) should be allowed to have one.
@Latrivia (2878)
• United States
13 Oct 09
If you support that idea, then you've fallen victim to the ideology that you have to be a certain kind of person to be able to vote. You see the types all the time. There are those who believe you should have to have a certain I.Q., pass a certain test, have a certain economical status, and yes, even be a tax payer.
The constitution has already set up guidelines for voting. We, as Americans, must receive equal protection of the laws, and saying that certain groups shouldn't be allowed to have the same rights as others is a line of thought that contradicts our constitution.
@pastorkayte (2255)
• United States
13 Oct 09
The only problem is that if I am a housewife who does not pay taxes would I then be unable to vote in elections. I wonder how that would work, does that mean only my husband is allowed to vote. Whatever the reason for what he said, it would violate the rights of more than half of the nations voters who would be excluded from the vote, which means primarily the vote would be in the hands of the rich and the working. What would a young mother who is in the welfare systems, the father who was laid of from his job due to economic problems, the college student who dont pay taxes but makes up a large part of the population. If they made this a law or even considered it this is what would happen, people would only get a job if they were one party or another, jobs would ask to find out what affiliation you are and how you feel about certain topics, then it would no longer be a free voting system, the government would control you. Again just someone with an opinion.
@thegreatdebater (7316)
• United States
14 Oct 09
You are 100% correct Pastor, and that was brought up, and Andrew said that as long as your man pays taxes then you would be allowed to vote. Another amendment to his stupidity.
Your post is what the host was thinking about in the first place, but many people called with exceptions like yours. I am married, have three kids, and make under $60,000 a year, so I don't pay a dime in federal income tax. When I was single, I paid over 28% of my income in taxes, now I don't pay a dime. Can you explain that one to me?
@Bluepatch (2476)
• Trinidad And Tobago
13 Oct 09
I don't see what paying taxes has got to do with voting. That is obviously a way to cut back on the opposition, no doubt.
Here is Trinidad, just a few years ago, you couldn't travel unless you had paid up all your taxes. That came in the form of what was known as a Tax Clearence. If you didn't have that you just could not travel anywhere.
Its a lot of big BS, if you ask me, what's travelling and voting got to do with stupid taxes ?
@thea09 (18305)
• Greece
13 Oct 09
Hi thegreatdebator, we have mandatory voting here with a four day weekend to get it done whilst everyone troops back to their original village. Amazingly this does not lead to resentment with the system but pride that everyone does vote, there is no apathy about it and most people debate politics actively. If one really does not like the options presented then one may legally deface the ballot paper but must turn up to do so. I think that you already have enough people there already apathetic enough not to vote without trying to exclude the ones who are willing.