Who is right?
By barbara7321
@barbara7321 (240)
United States
November 11, 2009 1:34am CST
Pam and Dave live together. Dave's mom called him and asked him to stop by. Dave's mom lives down the street. Dave told pam he was going to visit with his mom and be back shortly. Dave did not come home until almost five hours later and several beers under his belt. This left Pam upset and feeling like Dave doesn't care about her feelings enough to give her a courtesy call. Dave got upset when he found out Pam was upset. He thinks the entire argument is ridiculous and is now not speaking to Pam. He feels that Pam is too controlling and has no right to be upset over the time. After all he was at his mother's house right down the street. So.. Who is wrong here? What advice would you give this couple?
2 people like this
10 responses
@owlwings (43910)
• Cambridge, England
11 Nov 09
This is such a common incident, one might almost say that it is 'normal'. Nearly every couple has encountered a situation like this!
I would say that both are somewhat at fault for this misunderstanding. Communication is the key to a successful relationship and Dave did not communicate as Pam expected him to and felt that he should. Her expectations of him, though, are to a certain extent unrealistic and too high. By showing her annoyance that he didn't call, she is giving messages of a lack of trust (whether or not her trust has actually diminished) and possibly echoing words that Dave has heard from his mother in the past.
Actually, Pam does have a right to be upset. She may have been worried that Dave had got into an accident or something - no news is always bad news in these situations - and she does have a right to express her concern and worry but she may have done so in a way that Dave took as 'controlling'.
Dave should have called (but then Pam could equally well have called him when he was obviously taking longer than expected) but very often "a few minutes at mom's" can turn out to be much longer without one realising it. His real fault, though, is in his reaction to Pam's anxiety. Instead of belittling her emotions, he should be concerned that she was hurt and not be upset in return. He is showing a lack of respect and concern for Pam's feelings himself.
Both people need to think about what love means and understand something more about give and take. Love is a natural thing but living together in a partnership is something that we all have to learn. Really excellent parenting sometimes teaches people the basics but, unfortunately, most of us have experience just good to average parenting and find that living together as partners is very different from living with one's parents and brothers and sisters. Many issues from the child-parent relationship are unconsciously carried over into the partnership relationship and our emotional reactions are often inappropriate for some situations. We often need to re-think our emotional responses and learn how to deal with situations differently.
My advice would be that, when the anger has subsided somewhat, the couple should sit down and talk over their behaviour and reactions to this incident in a more mutually understanding way. Both should acknowledge the other's concerns and emotions and both should admit that they behaved in a way that wasn't as trusting and caring as it might have been.
1 person likes this
@barbara7321 (240)
• United States
11 Nov 09
This advice is very good. I do want to point out that Pam did tell Dave that her being upset wasn't about her not trusting him. She knew he was at his mothers, and knew he would be fine. It was the fact that she felt like he did not care about her feelings is what was bothering her. You are so correct in that we need to re-think our emotions and learn how to react in a more productive matter. Thank you.
@barbara7321 (240)
• United States
11 Nov 09
How do you feel Pam could have approached Dave so that a positive reaction could have occured. Right now she feels like she can't get anything right with Dave. She feels like her feelings are disregarded completely.
@happy6162 (3001)
• United States
11 Nov 09
Dave is wrong he should just have called Pam and told her he was going to be there for awhile. Pam could have called but Dave might have thought she was just checking up on him and he would have gotten angry. They need to have a discussion about communication better between the two of them.
1 person likes this
@sudiptacallingu (10879)
• India
12 Nov 09
Pam is wrong and Dave is right only till the point that Pam should not have been upset if Dave’s spending some more time with his mother without informing Pam about it…and they both are wrong if they are carrying this silly argument forward at the risk of their relationship and that also over the visit of the guy to his mother…for heaven’s sake, he was not at the pub or the girls!
And if Pam had been in Dave’s shoes…we know how most of us girls are when we are visiting our mom…hours fly by without even noticing it. But then yes, I wont to too harsh on Pam dear…it wouldn’t have cost Dave a fortune to give her a call and tell her that he’d be a little late…OR did Dave ‘know’ that Pam would not have liked the idea of Dave spending so much time at his mom’s?
@sid556 (30960)
• United States
11 Nov 09
I think that they both need to be a little more understanding toward each other here. Yes, it would have been thoughtful if Dave had given Pam a call and let her know that he was going to be later than planned.He did say that he'd be back shortly. Still, he was just down the road and at his mom's. She KNEW where he was. If she were so worried she could have called over and just made sure that all was ok. Dave, upon realizing that Pam was upset should just have appologized for being late and let it drop. Not talking to her is not going to help the situation. Neither of them are really right here.
@owlwings (43910)
• Cambridge, England
11 Nov 09
Yes, I completely agree that Dave is being harsh. I'd go further to say that he is being childish, pig-headed, disrespectful and uncaring, though perhaps I'm being a bit harsh here!
@barbara7321 (240)
• United States
11 Nov 09
She wasn't worried. She just wanted the respect of being notified that it wasn't going to be a short while. Why should she have to wait up for him if it was going to be so late? She could have made other plans instead of waiting on him. She wanted him to maybe be a bit more courteous. I think maybe it just common decency. What would a phone call have hurt? She often calls him when she is running late, and wants the same in return.
@barbara7321 (240)
• United States
11 Nov 09
I am sure she probably over reacted a bit too, but he isn't speaking to her. So he is being a bit harsh too.
@rg0205 (2636)
• Hong Kong
11 Nov 09
I think Dave is wrong because he should've told Pam.
Then again, if such things happen, I think there is a breakdown in communication between the two so it should be sorted out. Some couples think it's okay to go out without giving courtesy calls to one another. For other people, it matters a whole lot.
They should talk it through and talk about the expectations in the relationship to avoid conflicts of the same nature in the future.
@MickiMarcus (10)
• United States
12 Nov 09
I agree there is a communication issue here. This is definitely a topic that needs to be discussed between Dave and Pam to avoid such problems in the future. This would also be a great way to determine if this is maybe something that happens every time he visits his mom. Maybe he should ask Pam to join him in visiting with his mom. That just might open up a whole new bonding avenue for all 3 parties involved.
I used to visit my mom several times a week when I lived closer to her and sometimes I would go over there intending on staying for a short time and end up gone for 3-4 hours. This was a problem between my ex-husband and I because he knew it was going to happen, he expected it to happen, he was okay with it before it happened, but as soon as I would get home the yelling would commence.
I found out later it was because he felt left out. But, with that said, he was invited to come with me every time I went so that "I felt left out" argument was lame to say the least.
@rhemsley (27)
• Canada
12 Nov 09
In my opinion, both have valid reasons to be a little tiffed with each other, but I see Pam's biggest issue is one of trust. cleary the time he stayed at his mothers isn't the issue, but its the fact that he had been drinking. If this is a touchy subject with her, I would suggest serious discussions to solve the issue as soon as possible. work has to be done by Pam to trust Dave, and by Dave to understand more clearly the feelings of his partner. no one is right, no one is wrong, but there is work to be done.
@Ritchelle (3790)
• Philippines
12 Nov 09
first of all if you say it as it is: live together then pam has no liberty at all to get mad. i mean, yes, she can get mad but the problem is dave has no obligation at all moral or legal to give her all of his time. and pam doesn't any right at all to demand anything. what is given by each other is out of free will and courtesy that can and cannot be given if the other so desires. although it is not really a passport to get mad at a person just for the leisure of it because they are married it is a "risk" for anyone who are just living in together since this status makes any tantrum, however the concerned party sees it, as illegitimate, no big deal, whatever...
dave is also wrong in the sense that i believe he doesn't know the length of time a "visit" actually is. i think 5 hours is too long. i mean people has to have something productive to do with almost a fourth of the day, right?
as for pam, i'd not fault dave if dave is irritated with pam as with the first paragraph-argument i posted.
peace .
@laurynashlee06 (89)
• United States
12 Nov 09
I wouldn't say that neither of them are really wrong but I think that Dave should've atleast told Pam that he was going to be there longer than he expected.