how easily manipulated are you?

Well lets see, I was trying to be less confusing than I ended up being. So, I'll try this, anyone that goes into international business or other fields that have to do with international careers have to learn the customs and "norms" of the countries they will be dealing with. And, if they are so on this high and mighty "American's don't bow" thing than they had better talk their children into being farmers or a cab driver or something as to where they won't have to learn anything outside of their beloved America. They can stay in their closet as the world passes them by. Have you ever wondered why the citizens of this country have been failing? The US children are not in the top 10 of any subject around the world, car manufactures are failing foreign car makers. I could list all night long as to what the US is failing in but, I feel you are getting my general idea. Well we are failing because we want to keep our close minded thinking that we are so much better than the rest of world and we have actually forgotten where we came from, and no, I am not talking about the Constitution, I am talking about how we all came from other countries and this use to be the great "melting pot" and now, we are just a pot full of uneducated people. Personally, if I have to hear one more ignorant person talk about immigration and how we need to take back our country, I will have to take it upon myself to carve in their forehead so they can see it every day in the mirror that the only people that have the right to actually say that is Native Americans.

Please explain a little further Zephyr... Do you mean that if someone complains about the low bow, they are not understanding anything international? Or something else?

I forgot to address your remarks on the immigration opinions of some. Did you know that the Natives that Europeans found here when they first came here had disrupted another whole civilization that was here before them? Not that I don't agree...they were here before the Europeans. But they had tp displace the Mound Builders first. That is unfortunately the story of civilizations...strong displaces the weak. I don't say it right or fair, it just the facts. I am part Native, and very proud of that fact...so don't jump me for stating the facts. The problem most have with immigration is that so many do not do it legally and are here stealing from the tax revenues that many AMERICANS cannot even qualify for. I agree, that is wrong. I have three grandparents who came here legally and quickly learned the language and did not expect a free handout. THAT my friend was the melting pot. Not those who come here, refuse to obey the laws and get more benefits than those who were born here and obey the laws. Fair is fair...and I also know two Mexicans who came here legally and obey the laws and are accepted into the 'redneck' land in which I live....and btw..they despise their own countrymen who insist on coming into America illegally just as much as those rednecks.

well the question was not about sources - it was about whether you think about and question things before making your mind up, basically letting the media you pay attention to makes it up for you, and is a question for everybody to everybody you brought up trivial. we are on to interpretation of what is trivial - ok you don't think this example was trivial, that's fine. if you felt this rather than allowed yourself to be made to feel this... debra, as for sources a crafty way to stop them being questioned is to link to sources from the other side. since here i've been lumped in the 'liberal' box i've done this by linking to for example fox news or the telegraph for an elaboration of whichever story i posted about. don't see any others doing this though. i personally also like to see a particularly story interpreted in different ways because spin is inevititable.

I try to do that too. Lately it's getting easier over here because the mainstream has begun question fearless leader. lol I think it is just a cop out to say...that source is biased or that is a source I don't accept. But yes, the way around that is to post sources they would accept. But tell me jb...why should that be necessary? Like my example up above, I'd like to see anyone try to prove Obama is a natural born citizen of the US using WND. If I, like them (theoretically) demanded MY sources only be used, that would limit them in their sources, wouldn't it? It becomes a case of I don't want to see it, so I will not look.

It does all boil down to frame of referrence. If you don't want your mind changed on a particular issue, no amount of 'evidence' will change it. If you don't like what you see and hear, denounce it as biased or denounce the source as biased or as having an agenda. There seems to be a biased there...in not accepting people's sources. Like some say...I don't do youtube. Yet they will accept the TV broadcast of said youtube video? Does it change once it gets on the internet? And they will be the first to always post THEIR liberal sources. I'd love to see for once, someone go to World Net Daily to prove Obama IS a citizen. lol After all, they expect us to only use sources they approve of. Maybe we all should depend on the opposing sources for our opinions. Maybe we all should think alike. What a wonderful world!

I doubt it. Negativity doesn't get you anywhere either. So stop that!

your grandmother had the right idea. definitely don't think you need to be worried about your star btw, you've answered the question but not stepped into the political angle so any neg trollers probably won't bother you . keep an eye on mine, zeph's and debi's though. (i'm expecting a 5 tomorrow )

And there I was telling my partner that I would be amazed if anyone picked up on that. Well done that woman! To expand, one of the things that I find most annoying is the way most people see things purely in terms of dualities; there is almost NEVER an issue which has only two sides to it. Most issues are spectra. Lash

Oh no! there's more than two sides to a story...you've just increased my work load by a zillion percent! Two was hard enough to deal with...thanks a lot!

Debsie, you weren't the only one using Ickle as a source last week but don't twist it into the one thing he said you agreed with as you'd never even heard of him before you liked what he said on that atrocious video. The man is an out and out certifiable loon. Just be confident enough in your own opinion to give your own views and not always be sticking sources in. As you've now used Ickle as a source I would be very wary of ever giving any respect to any other source you use as you've shown that you know nothing about your sources, or didn't there. At least you've decided to go along with JB and I's more analytical view that your source is nothing other than a total nutter. He has been ever since he appeared on the BBC declaring he was the son of god.

he is the nutcase evrybody says.

that's me! lol I did clarify that it was that one thing that I agreed with, if indeed he is the nutcase you say. People tend to dismiss all someone says just cause they don't always say the right thing. I've learned that truth is an entity of its own...it can show up at the darndest times and in the weirdest places.

well debs that is impressive - the only thing is i suspect if you had come across evidence that didn't support the view you'd formed immediately you might have discounted it (put those books down please). however you have supported your view fairly well and this is s decent argument.

But dear jb...my opinion was based on already knowing something of the custom and I merely went looking for concrete evidence.

To say that more clearly: your discussion title is 'how easily manipulated are you?' My contention is educated people are harder to manipulate.

hiya hatley - i agree with you about being respectful to others. when i don't agree i am certainly not going to start calling you or anybody else names...i'm not a troll, i am a wererabbit . wererabbits are [fairly] polite.

good [attempts to manipulate karen] now have i told you just how evil potatoes are yet? the list of their demonic activities is endless [witters on for a while] [having probably failed to convince anybody of the fiendishness of potatoes reconsiders tabloid journalism as a new career]

well you sound analytical - the media and politicians don't like that very much. extreme generalisation about relative ages of children though, which i shall agree with simply because it suits me (i'm the eldest)

You know, that all makes sense. Take a look at history, when you find out the details behind all the events they begin to make more sense. I can remember thinking as a kid, why did they do this or that? Because all I had was the overview of history, you know.... names, dates and events. Then as an adult I found sources that explained the cultural, economic, religious, and social details of those events and history began to make sense to me. Perhaps it WAS Bush's kissy face antics with the Saudi prince that clues people into what they should be concerned about and what is trivial. I too, consider myself a leader. I'm the youngest...but in reality grew up as an only child as all my siblings were so much older than I. So...I guess I learned to think for myself too. I'm used to finding my own way as you state you are. Some see the big picture, some analyze the details. Obama has made statements that many people believe are anti American. At least anti what they thought America was. They see the details of his administration as a way to understand the bigger picture. You look at the big picture. Good. That's just as much needed as looking at the details. Some are now are waking from their complacent slumber to the fact that our country is being sold out. As jb pointed out, that tends to push some people's buttons. To call them names or imply they are ignorant is wrong. We all need to find a way to work together and quit this crap of fighting amongst ourselves over who is a good American or who is not...or it really won't matter anymore of is a good American and who is not, cause there will be no America.

you mean they make mistakes? yes they certainly do.