do two wrongs make a right?

@jb78000 (15139)
March 23, 2010 7:57am CST
does bad behaviour by one lot of people cancel out bad behaviour by another? i didn't think it did - bad behaviour is bad behaviour. however in lots of discussions here apparently it does. we get the 'bush did it first' 'bush haters were as bad as obama haters' 'obama haters are as bad as bush haters' (in fact usually the words in these are 'worse than') 'a democrat/republican did something worse than the democrat/republican we are currently discussing' and of course the ever popular 'you started it'. taken to its extremes this kind of very childish logic leads to horrendous situations such as the troubles in northern ireland. in the states it seems to be mainly name calling but it still doesn't make much sense to try and excuse one action with another bad one. what is your view and have you ever done this yourself? (no i won't bite your head off, i think most people, including the sensible ones, in here have at some point)
8 people like this
15 responses
@laglen (19759)
• United States
23 Mar 10
I agree we all have done it at one point or another. However, I would have hoped that our ADULT politicians would be better than that. But they are not. And not just politicians, but the media, people here, people everywhere! It does not fix anything and in my opinion just makes things worse. I really am sick of hearing everything that Bush did wrong. We all know, lets move on and fix it. Lets stop making these bad choices and learn from past mistakes. No President here has ever been "perfect" nor Prime Minister or King even. Time to move on.
@jb78000 (15139)
23 Mar 10
there is no such thing as a Good King or Perfect President however easy it would be to think this. most are imperfect, a few are indeed Very Bad Presidents (or usually bad dictators, bush and obama are NOT examples)
2 people like this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
24 Mar 10
Not wantin to bring that one huh? Good! Some people get so touchy around here
@jb78000 (15139)
24 Mar 10
taking bush as an example because i didn't like what he did and obama hasn't been around long enough for me to have a strong opinion but same thing goes. bush was a decent enough man, who perhaps you think should not have been a president. he was in no way comparable to the truly evil like hitler, or being more up to date, mugabe.
1 person likes this
• United States
23 Mar 10
Oh the whole US VS THEM thing. I find it sad. Why? Because they buy into the whole thing. That is what each party wants...rabbid followers who will defend them no matter what and attack the other side no matter what. IT is stupid. No two wrongs don't make a right. It is also stupid for people to make excuses for bad behavior done by politicans...no matter what letter is beside their name. But I see it all the time...I have seen people scream and throw a fit when a politican from the "other" party does something wrong...but when a politican from "their" party does it...well that is perfectly ok. They will find a way ....any way to try and justify it. Hypocrites. they play into both parties hands. They WANT supporters that will support, defend and fight for them no matter what they do. They take advantage of it. those people are being used. I don't know if they don't realize it or if they think it is ok that they are being used. Each party plays the whole "we are teh good guys" and "they are the bad guys" thing and people buy into it. When in reality...neither party is the "good guy". Both are the "bad guy" and they have the american public fooled into fighting for them. Think about it...what are you fight for? COrruption, greed, double dealings, back door deals...I mean really...take a long hard look at them. Most of them are not good people..most are nto even DECENT people. So why fight for them? Why enable them?
2 people like this
• United States
23 Mar 10
Yep...democrats are soo busy trying to trash the republicans they don't see or care about the BS going on in their own party. The republicans are so busy trying to trash the Democrats they don't see or care about the BS the republicans are doing. It really makes it nice for the politicans. They have us fighting their battles for them...and defending them even if they don't deserve it. It is completely crazy in my opinion.
2 people like this
@jb78000 (15139)
23 Mar 10
an excellent way to manipulate and motivate people is to provide them with a handy Enemy they can focus on. also when they have An Enemy they are less likely to keep an eye on what you are up to.
2 people like this
@dawnald (85146)
• Shingle Springs, California
23 Mar 10
Somebody has to really, really hurt me or really tick me off, to get me to reply anywhere near in like kind. Mostly I just avoid conflict and let the idiot think they've won.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85146)
• Shingle Springs, California
30 Mar 10
when it gets to the point where it's obvious that you're talking to a brick wall, I guess there's no point in continuing...
@jb78000 (15139)
30 Mar 10
i don't reply in kind to rude comments, spoken or written, but i don't avoid conflict. i probably should
1 person likes this
@spalladino (17891)
• United States
23 Mar 10
I can't think of any specifics when it comes to my participation in this kind of behavior...but I'm not ruling it out because I'm as human as anyone else. I do find this tactic to be very unproductive in any discussion because it attempts to justify one wrong by throwing the focus on another wrong. When that happens it's very difficult, if not impossible, to find a middle ground.
@jb78000 (15139)
28 Mar 10
everybody loses their temper or makes poor judgements sometimes. think somebody added that to the tags here. it's handy to realise what effect this kind of tactic has though, it does't really help the person doing it to make a compelling case. usually it just gets a never ending argument going.
@catdla1 (6005)
• United States
23 Mar 10
There are two subjects that certainly bring out the worst in many people. Politics and religion. Personally, I'd like to see the political parties abolished, so that people would (maybe) really listen to what leaders are saying, not just agreeing or disagreeing because of the party they belong to. The battle here over healthcare is ridiculous. Those with health insurance are fighting against those who do not. I don't understand the logic of that. How can religious right-to-lifers on one hand push for eliminating abortions, while at the same time condemning others for lack of medical coverage?
2 people like this
@jb78000 (15139)
27 Mar 10
worst of all is when politics and religion are combined. and the reason you don't understand the logic of that particular viewpoint is because it is not exactly based on logic. more on emotion.
@trruk1 (1028)
• United States
23 Mar 10
Responding to a difference of opinion by launching a personal attack is entirely too common. Instead of providing a rational counterpoint, the response takes the form of "You are just a..." --fill in the blank with liberal, socialist, communist, atheist, neo-Nazi,racist, or whatever, as if that is some kind of answer. It is as if the response to "Your shoe is untied" was a diatribe about your ancestry. Sometimes, though, it is so absurd it is just funny and pathetic. Like the guy who yelled at a town meeting that the government needed to keep its hands off his--Social Security. Maintaining a sense of humor is crucial.
2 people like this
@jb78000 (15139)
23 Mar 10
it is pretty pathetic. basically you are saying 'i can't think of anything sensible to say but i am really angry so i am going to shout names at you'
1 person likes this
@GardenGerty (160658)
• United States
23 Mar 10
I probably have done it, but do not remember any specifics. It is not very adult or logical to do this. Two wrongs do not make a right, and actually it is much more than two wrongs, I am sure. We forget that we are all part of the same country and should all be trying to make it better.
@jb78000 (15139)
24 Mar 10
fighting is more fun
@matersfish (6306)
• United States
24 Mar 10
And this is new stuff? Politics has long been held as a topic that will bring out the worst in people - along with religion. Rarely does it go to extremes. Citing that it can is its own brand of fearmongering, in a sense. I think everyone is aware of that. And to date, barring the sporadic incident of reported (with no evidence) insulting slurs and spitting, and a few cases of union thugs beating a man senseless and some pro-immigration thugs beating someone senseless, nothing is very harmful but the loosely thrown, often inaccurate rhetoric. In politics, the bad behavior excusing more or being used to point out hypocrisy is just a way of affirming your side and denegrating someone else's. Some folks are very passionate about what they believe or are told to believe. But, just as your previous discussion about hate-filled right-wingers waging war on everyone, I do not see disagreement--even harsh disagreement--as particularly harmful. I also don't see some sudden uprise in weak attempts to justify bad behavior. I think maybe you're just paying more attention these days. Sure, something could erupt. But something can always erupt. Damn. I recently watched some videos of people throwing fits at fast food restaurants because of the long waits in line and receiving the wrong order. Some guy punched a 16 year old girl and another attempted to assult the register worker. That's just as many incidents as the thick political climate has given us. Should we be wary of going into McDonald's now? Personally, on the bad behavior thing, I've certainly cited someone else's to prove a point. I always find it helpful when someone's being a hypocrite. And if anyone can call me on the same, I fully expect them to.
• United States
24 Mar 10
"no, because i didn't say it was going to go to extremes" True enough for this. I was judging your total body of work, however, and making a call. The discussion I'm referring to: "Right-wingers will eat your babies and blow up the urf! Remember the last time the lunatic right took power? Well, it's HAPPENING!" But I do agree that some behaviors can be a bad thing. But in the context of a political debate, wherein some schmo might justify his or his side's bad behavior by pointing to bad behavior across the aisle, I don't believe that's harmful. I mean, you notice it and call bullsh1t. You're not the world's most intelligent human. That's not a dig. You might be a damn sight smarter than I am. I'm just saying... Others notice it, too, and realize that it's just a load of BS reserved for certain things like politics. It's something that really stirs up passion in people, and like I'm reading others write, they don't really want to be wrong about what they feel is right. A good way to keep up the strong facade and to show your beliefs or actions are merited is to defend strongly anything questioned. Sometimes that calls for using someone else's bad behavior as justification. Right or wrong -- who can call it? It seems a might silly from the outside of any particular instance looking in. But from the inside, it's all about perception and what tickles your particular fancy.
@jb78000 (15139)
24 Mar 10
"Right-wingers will eat your babies and blow up the urf! Remember the last time the lunatic right took power? Well, it's HAPPENING!" you know full well i do not put things like that. however i was making a point about how dangerous the far right can be, and it is gaining power in my country (the bnp) and yours. i am not talking about very conservative people. 'You're not the world's most intelligent human' at least you added that neither are you. of course i am not the world's most intelligent human, there are some people out there who are amazingly intelligent and i am not one of them. nobody in here is. 'Others notice it, too,' notice what? that there are no geniuses apparently active on mylot? wow, perceptive. just when you get back to this do not try to imply i am stupid. this i am not and neither are you. anyway i am not quite sure why you are trying to argue matersfish. you seem to agree with the point of this particular discussion, if you want to debate about a discussion of mine you believe to be bs then go there.
@jb78000 (15139)
24 Mar 10
'Citing that it can is its own brand of fearmongering, in a sense' no, because i didn't say it was going to go to extremes or that it was extreme. i was using an example of this logic from a country other than yours as an extreme example. 'But, just as your previous discussion about hate-filled right-wingers waging war on everyone' what discussion are you refering to here? i may not have been making exactly the point you think i was. let me know which discussion you are referring to and what you think i was saying. 'I do not see disagreement--even harsh disagreement--as particularly harmful' agreed. disagreement can be a good thing. certain behaviour however i don't think is and i doubt you do either. 'I think maybe you're just paying more attention these days.' Well not more attention to the news for example but you are probably right as the new thing is mylot and the playground is full of this.
• United States
23 Mar 10
I am not sure. I mean, we were taught that "two wrongs don't make a right". Then we go to school, and our English teachers tell us that two negatives make a positive. Once we finally get that concept, our Math teachers tell us that sometimes two negatives make a positive, but sometimes they just make another negative. It is all very confusing! What was the question again?
1 person likes this
@jb78000 (15139)
23 Mar 10
i've forgotten but i don't think it had much to do with arithmetic.
2 people like this
@vandana7 (100280)
• India
23 Mar 10
Why are we identifying any fiscal or political decision with a person like Obama or Bush? A hundred years down the lane such passionate beliefs would make no sense. Like hardly anybody knows who was the president of the United States during the great depression or even the World War I. Moreover, we outsiders would always be looking at it as America has this policy or the US tried this policy. If it succeeded, why cant we kind of approach to any steps taken in hte US. We are not going to say Bush succeeded with this, or Obama succeeded with that. It is America - the nation! Now coming to two wrongs make a right - no. Each is to be viewed independently of the other.
@jb78000 (15139)
24 Mar 10
great point vandana. i started a discussion before about how much the power the figurehead has, and so how much they are really responsible for. not at much as some people think i feel, at least in democracies.
@hexeduser22 (7419)
• Philippines
31 Mar 10
People must learn to not to confuse between the behavioral studies and physics. No matter whose side won there will be still conflict. People will just keep doing the wrong things specially the fanatics and the hard headed ones. People will keep looking for people to blame except for themselves I admit I started it all I made them all do it. negative + negative = positive, sperm + sperm = makes a gay and egg + sperm = makes a man acknowledge by the bible
@MJay101 (710)
24 Mar 10
Being an awkward b*stard, I'd question the question. What is "wrong" and what is "right"? My own area of (limited) expertise is the Russian revolution. When the reds won the civil war, they committed many atrocities against the devastated white armies, and the civilian population - however, those who carried out the atrocities fully believed that they were doing the "right" thing. After all, how can you build a workers' paradise whilst bourgeois counter-revolutionaries are still alive? I'd question the extremes to which the Soviets went (as a bit of a wuss, myself), but not their essential point: truth is relative and "right" depends on your ideological viewpoint. So, I pretty much take it as given that republicans and tories are always wrong - because of the underlying ideas which inform their sense of "right". Even if they came up with a decent policy or two, it would be wrong, because it would be informed by an ideology that is essentially malevolent. But then, I'm a stubborn kinda guy.
1 person likes this
@hofferp (4734)
• United States
23 Mar 10
No, two wrongs don't make a right. It's just sometimes it's difficult to keep your cool when tempers start flaring, then things are said that shouldn't have been said.
@jb78000 (15139)
24 Mar 10
as i said i think most people who regularly post in here have probably done this at some point. certainly i think everybody has lost their temper on at least one occasion.
@hofferp (4734)
• United States
24 Mar 10
Yeah, I've come pretty close to losing my temper MyLotting on politics (only). My favored approach, before really going overboard, stop MyLotting. Turn around and walk away...
@umit_umit (1984)
• India
24 Mar 10
yes it can happen,that two wrongs can make one right!very times it has hppened!
• Canada
24 Mar 10
Politicians are all liars and why do we bother listening to them anymore is beyond me. We all know they're full of it, corrupt to the core and yet, they all go, YAY the king is here (or queen, or whatever you call your guy at the top). Here its scandal after scandal and yet the big dip goes in front of the camera and tells everybody that all is well and the other side if full of it and of course the other side will do the same. So, ONE bad, usually cancels another one for the simple reason that people will believe or listen to the LAST person who said something and then it all starts all over again. There is no democracy anymore and if anyone is trying to tell you that you live in a democratic country, slap them hard on the back of the head to wake them up.