Why do people think there is a contradiction between free-will and determinism?

Philippines
October 26, 2010 10:47am CST
Determinism is that all actions including human decisions can be pre-determined with enough knowledge while free-will is the ability to make my own decisions and doing it the way you like it. Both are actually correct. If you have a problem with that, why do you believe human decisions can’t be determined with enough knowledge? This is a real intellectual topic. Please share your thoughts guys.
1 person likes this
3 responses
• Canada
28 Oct 10
The concept of determinism is that, since everything is mathematically pre-determined, you have no other choice but to do what you do. For example: you might think you chose to have cereal this morning, but really, since every single atom in the universe moves only according to the forces that act on it, those atoms must move a certain way -- including the atoms in your hand that poured a bowl of cereal. Since everything is a chain reaction back to the beginning of time, you could not have had toast for breakfast even if you wanted to (but of course, you wouldn't want to, because the atoms that make up the chemical reactions in your brain are subject to the same forces, etc.) Some people think that a choice made, when nothing else could really be done, doesn't count as a "free" choice, while some do. It might be that you "chose" to do everything you do, but your state of mind leading to your "choice" is pre-determined. Am I correct in thinking it is your view that, if you would have chosen to do it anyway, that makes it a free choice of yours, even if you could not have chosen otherwise? Because that is one of the proposals put forth by compatibalism.
• Philippines
28 Oct 10
Thank you so much for the great response. I will get back to you on this. Just really busy right now because my manager is asking a lot of things at this moment.
• Philippines
28 Oct 10
I will just have to say in a simple manner that whatever we want to do is not always being executed because we are thinking of the repercussions it may bring us after we have done those things that we want to do. We are forced to do whatever we should have to do and not what we always want.
• Canada
28 Oct 10
You are correct that there is no contradiction in being able to predict people's freely chosen decisions. That is not the point of people who do not believe in compatibilism. The contradiction lies in the fact that, if absolutely everything is determined by physics, then one cannot do anything but what one is determined to do (see example above.) Generally, we do not feel like we are making free choices if we could not do anything but one thing -- even if that is the thing we would have chosen anyway.
@DawGwath (1042)
• Romania
26 Oct 10
Humans can be both predictable and unpredictable. Like most species, we respond on an instinctive level to most of our environmental stimuli. Part of our daily activities, our mood and our responses to stressful situations, can and will be determined by various factors, depending on your nature and self-control. If one would so much observe the behavioural responses of one person to certain stimuli, he might notice a repeating pattern that could render him the tools of determining future decisions regarding that person. But that doesn't give him a 100% foolproof technique, as people may respond differently in similar situations and vice-versa. Free-will is pretty much overrated. Yes, we do have a choice between taking a plane or a train, eating fast-food, at a restaurant or cooking home, stealing or being an honest citizen, living or taking our own lives, or even the lives of others. But the multitude of choices is most of the time reduced to one, as you will choose what you usually do or like, what your instinct tells you (or what your wallet allows you for that matter). To take advantage of the full capacity of free-will you have to leave your confort zone, which, to most of us, is a "too much of a sacrifice".
• Philippines
26 Oct 10
This philosophical position, called compatibilism, requires a true and specific understanding of the two key concepts involved. A number of core problems and misconceptions have so far prevented this view from becoming generally accepted: A mis-identification of what "freewill" actually refers to. Confusion between two different aspects of determinism: mechanistic causation, and predictability. The mistaken belief that freewill cannot be a mechanistic mental process. Various other fallacious objections to determinism, freewill, and compatibilism, including deeply embedded beliefs, powerful intuitive misconceptions, and "cognitive illusions". It is still hard for most of the people to do things beyond their comfort zone even if the will to do it is there. It is in our nature to do things in a manner that we will not be having a hard time doing it. Thank you for your enlightening response.
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@DawGwath (1042)
• Romania
28 Oct 10
Hmmm, interesting proposition. *chin rubbing* I haven't documented much on this subject, but at the moment I'm studying psychology and philosophy. I'll probably stumble over this "compatibilism" you are talking about and I will be better prepared to engage in a substantial discussion.
• Philippines
28 Oct 10
Sure. I would love to hear your thoughts regarding that one. I will also be prepared as well. Thank you for the response.
1 person likes this
@IsisGreen (554)
1 Nov 10
What do you mean by "free will"? "Choosing your actions"? In which case, what do you mean by "choosing"? The ability to predict in advance what you then do. (No contradiction) Or the ability to, ex post, have actually done something different from what you did do. (Contradiction)