So much for your Freedom of Speech

@laglen (19759)
United States
June 2, 2011 11:09pm CST
A FEDERAL judge ruled banning students and other speakers from using religious language in their speeches. Among the banned words or phrases are: “join in prayer,” “bow their heads,” “amen,” and “prayer.” Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/06/02/prayer-prohibited-at-graduation-ceremony/#ixzz1OBLNyJve Judge Biery ordered that his ruling be “enforced by incarceration or other sanctions One student and his parents claim that if God is mentioned then their child will suffer irreparable harm. wow I wonder what that is....
2 people like this
15 responses
@matersfish (6306)
• United States
3 Jun 11
This is always the case - it's always ONE PERSON offended that brings in a sweeping change. And let's be honest. They're not really friggin' offended. They feing offense because they can, because they'll be listened to and catered to. Here's what I have to say to the one person's parents: Go pluck yourselves. If your kid will hear "God" and be harmed, he's a little sissy boy who you should have let play dodgeball and taken the switch to instead of using your timeouts. Now this poor schmuck is doomed to a lifetime of therapy when he accidentally catches an old rerun of Highway to Heaven. Now he'll go limp and fail at life when he watches the next Morgan-Freeman-as-God movie, Cliff Almighty. He might kamikaze his way out in a minivan should he accidentally hit the remote and change to a Christian channel. There are a lot of people in this country who are not religious and want nothing to do with prayer. You're looking at one right here. However, even though I might giggle to myself while people are praying, I fully respect their right to do so, and I know that it's not going to harm me any more than people singing Christmas carols or telling me to have a nice day when I leave Burger King! These types of idiots file lawsuits because the precedent has been sent. If you live in America, the supposed land of the free and home of the brave, your feelings are protected in a lot of courts. Things you do not agree with become big-time cases for schmuck lawyers seeking idiots for clients. Judges have no back bone. Tell people that they're being ridiculous sissies and watch how suddenly people stop being "offended" by inconsequential things like prayer.
2 people like this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
so right. nowhere is it written that you have a right to not be offended. Frickin ninnies
@debrakcarey (19887)
• United States
5 Jun 11
Thats what I say...stand up to them!
1 person likes this
@Rollo1 (16679)
• Boston, Massachusetts
3 Jun 11
If I were a graduating student, I would probably try to get all the students to shout "Amen" as they toss their caps in the air. Let them arrest the entire graduating class. Speakers should be allowed to speak freely. If the school fears their speech is inappropriate, then they shouldn't invite those speakers. The Valedictorian has earned the right to that speech and his or her speech shouldn't be interfered with. If that one student would be irreparably harmed by any mention of religion, then that student should be cloistered immediately after graduation. There won't be any living in the real world for that kid. In the real world it's more difficult to get judges to forbid others to say things you don't like. I always find it interesting that these types are never irreparably harmed by the mention of any religion except Christianity. Don't they realize that by that one peculiarity, they are essentially admitting that it's the only empowered religion, the only one that can cause them to feel ill at ease with their own choices, the only one that pr1cks their consciences? Just sayin'...
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
good point Rollo, and wouldnt it make more sense to tell the one student to not attend?
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
amen
@hofferp (4734)
• United States
3 Jun 11
I'm with you, Rollo. I'd get as many students as I could to shout "Amen", but I wouldn't wait for the toss of the caps. The minute the superintendent/principal introduced himself/herself, we'd all yell "Amen", and if it got that far, we'd yell "Amen" to everyone/everything else that was said. After they removed 90% of the graduating class (and Moms, Dads, family and friends...) and hauled them off to jail, it'd be interesting to see who was left...
1 person likes this
@suspenseful (40193)
• Canada
3 Jun 11
I suppose that atheistic communist judge also bans prayers for a school team to win, or someone praying that he would passGods name shall not be used in vain, but I suspect that the ban was not because of that reason. Just another example of secularism in America.
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
I think it goes far beyond that. This is a blatant violation of OUR Constitutional rights.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
5 Jun 11
Yes you are right. It is Freedom OF Religion. By the way, Canada is a beautiful country, I would head for the Yukon.... so watch out!
1 person likes this
@suspenseful (40193)
• Canada
4 Jun 11
Is it not in your Constitution about Freedom of Religion, not Freedom from Religion? Well everytime I turn on my Tv I can see evidence that belief in God has gone out the window. And America is turning into a godless country. If one does not take action, America will become a dictatorship and people will be fleeing to Canada not to escape the draft but to escape tyranny.
1 person likes this
• United States
6 Jun 11
Personally, it doesn't bother me when people TALK about god. What bothers me is when those same people don't practice what they preach. Don't you just hate activist judges that screw with this great country? Damn shame we can't do anything about the activist court in the country, but the Supreme Court has life terms, and the milk every second of it.
@laglen (19759)
• United States
7 Jun 11
I agree and I believe that what you said X, is exactly what their job is. Making the hard choices, ruling according to the Constitution whether they like it or not.
1 person likes this
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
6 Jun 11
Agreed. that court has become an abomination. I don't agree with using the court to "interpret" the constitution and there is no solid constitutional description of such a duty assigned to them. But at least back in the day they would err on the side of the constitution, whether they agreed with the out come or not. Now-a-days, they interpret based on the letter next to the name of the person who appointed them. Constitutional fidelity means siding with the constitution when it is difficult to do so as well as when it is easy, cut and dry.
2 people like this
@debrakcarey (19887)
• United States
3 Jun 11
Well, I'd counter with 'it would do ME irreparable harm to be forbidden to mention God. And why is it MUSLIM prayer and teachings can be uttered in schools? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7-I9Qp3d4Y In late May of 2010, Wellesley, Massachusetts public middle school students took a field trip to the Islamic Society of Boston Cultural Center - a controversial Saudi-funded mega-mosque run by the Muslim American Society of Bostn. There, the students were separated by gender and the boys were asked to join the Muslim adults in their prayer. Several of the public school boys took part.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
See, that to me is more harmful but I wouldnt have a problem. I am a believer that you must seek your own spirituality.
@laglen (19759)
• United States
5 Jun 11
Luckily she won on Appeal and yes the same case.
@debrakcarey (19887)
• United States
4 Jun 11
I heard about a girl, might be the same one you tell about. She is valedictorian of her class and has been told by a federal judge she cannot pray or mention God in her talk. She will be in contempt of court if she does. She will be on Fox in the morning talking about it. What else was said is this particular judge ruled against the Supreme Court that said a person can pray before or after a speech as long as it is a voluntary event. So, I think this girl is going to go ahead and do as she wants and let them arrsest her and fight it all the way if she has to. Sad way to have to start your adult life isn't it?
1 person likes this
@SIMPLYD (90722)
• Philippines
3 Jun 11
I think in speeches where there are visitors of various religions present, it is really irrelevant to be using those words. As a respect to other religion these words should really be banned. However, for me it is wrong for the speaker to be punished for it by incarceration. Maybe it would have been better, if whoever will be giving a speech, he/she should be sternly warned not to use those words lest she/he will be made to stop even in the middle of her speech. At least it's a justifiable punishment.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
But bottom line, in America, you can not "ban words". This judge just did.
@laglen (19759)
• United States
5 Jun 11
And this ruling was overturned on appeal.
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
5 Jun 11
Why should a federal judge have the power to dictate what can and can not be said? The first amendment is rather clear on the issue of free speech.
1 person likes this
@bobmnu (8157)
• United States
3 Jun 11
The Standard for Student speech has been for years that the school can not control the students speech. When I was a Principal every year at Graduation time I would received a letter from the ACLU and the Center for Law and Justice and they told me two things 1. The School could not restrict the students speech. 2. The School could not encourage or allow religious speech. The rule we were told to follow by our lawyers was not to ask a student to give a prayer or blessing. Instead have the student give a welcoming. Do not tell the students what they can and can not say in their speech, I had the following statement approved by lawyers: "You speech should be appropriate to the occasion (graduation). You are talking to your classmates, parents, grand parents and community members." One of the best speeches I had was a boy, selected by the students, who gave the main speech. As he ended his speech he asked the class and audience to "take a moment and think of all the people you should thank for your success, Your Parents, Teachers, friends, supporters and Jesus Christ Amen." The speech was not religious in nature but he did get the prayer before anyone knew they were praying.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
5 Jun 11
Sad that he has to "slip it in". But kudos to him!
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
4 Jun 11
I WISH they would have tried this bull$hit when I was graduating highschool. I can assure you I would have said each and every word that was banned. I'd LOVE to be the one fighting that battle in court. I'd be an instant celebrity.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
5 Jun 11
Taskr, I think the Valedictorian was ready to take this fight..
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
4 Jun 11
I should also point out that this is part of the left wing extremist agenda. They want a national religion and that religion is atheism. They don't want Christianity to coexist with other beliefs, they just want atheism to be the law of the land.
1 person likes this
@Latrivia (2878)
• United States
5 Jun 11
According the the Examiner, the ruling was appealed and reversed. Kudos to the appeals judge. I hate atheists and agnostics who get their panties in a twist over stuff like this. It doesn't hurt anyone to sit quietly while a peer prays, and if it does, then they need to get some thicker skin.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
5 Jun 11
I agree and yes Thank God this was overturned!!
@xfahctor (14118)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
6 Jun 11
This is getting ridiculous,. I know it has been overturned since this was posted but still. Someone getting up and praying in a graduation speech is not government establishing religion. In fact, not letting someone pray during said speech is a violation of their religious freedom ("nor prohibiting the free exercise thereof"). I could care less if a graduate wants to say amen, drop a prayer rug and face Mecca for a minute, put on a yarmulke and read from the Torah or hold an Athame in praise and thanks to the goddess. It's their religion and it is their right to express and practice it. No on was forcing anyone else to pray.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
7 Jun 11
I couldnt agree more. Thankfully it was overturned but it is scary that it got this far.
@dark_joev (3034)
• United States
3 Jun 11
Schools personally I believe to be a good place to challenge ones ideas and beliefs I mean it got me to wake up from the Roman Catholic Church and to also challenge my understanding. This isn't an issue of whether or not it is a purge of a Religious Idea it is an issue of ones freedom to freely associate with a Religion or Belief system and this is a freedom of Speech or as Ron Paul would say a First Amendment issue which the Federal Government has no right to step into. I mean really. This is scary really scary. But I mean the feds can control who you marry and what you do with your body. So it doesn't surprise me.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
good points. Boy, permission for who you marry, that sounds familiar!
@bestboy19 (5478)
• United States
4 Jun 11
Whether or not the school abides by the judges ruling, I believe it should send a letter to Christa and Danny Schultz telling them their son will not be participating in the schools graduation ceremonies do to the irreparable harm his presence would cause the whole graduating class. His certificate will be mailed to him.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19759)
• United States
5 Jun 11
However, an update, the ruling was overturned. The Valedictorian can now say a prayer. So I guess the Schultz kid will be damaged...
@dlr297 (5409)
• United States
9 Jun 11
It is a good thing that the Judge was not here when this country was founded, because then most of our for-founders would have been in trouble because they freely talked about God, and used prayer to help guide them to make the right decisions. Prayer is used to open a session in congress........... They are taking away are freedoms one at a time, and as long as we all sit and say or do nothing no one is to blame but us. This not only effects our freedom of speech but our freedom of religion.
• France
3 Jun 11
This is a blatantly horrific example of how laws have skewed society. We had ten commandments before, but now we have thousands of laws that change depending on your state, country, or region. The freedom of speech - a very old and long-standing constitutional right - is pitted against a new and seemingly poorly-thought-out law on using religious (Catholic in particular) language in public discourse. There is obviously some conflict and contradiction here. If the language were being forced onto students and they were being told to repeat the words forcefully, then this would be a problem. However, from the context it is merely a request for the audience to WILLINGLY follow the instruction of uttering "join us in prayer" and the like. If a student so wishes not to participate, there are no sanctions. If a student does not want to listen, by all means cover your ears. There is no coercion by force being enacted. Therefore the law is entirely baseless. If you are a parent or student who chooses to go to a school with Catholic roots, then by God understand the repercussions of such a decision. Respect the school's majority belief and they shall respect your minority beliefs. They still go on vacation on Muslim holidays! The biggest problem really here is the terms of punishment. How can uttering these words for the public harmful? How does it impinge on others' rights to the point of deserving jail time? This is another perfect example of judicial extremism. Sad but true.
@laglen (19759)
• United States
3 Jun 11
I agree this is judicial extremism and a blatant violation of a freedom of speech. You have a freedom to speak but it doesnt mean everybody has to like it...
@elmiko (6630)
• United States
4 Jun 11
this isn't anything new although its sad.