Religion?
By rifnee
@rifnee (1713)
Indonesia
July 21, 2011 10:35am CST
I want to address any particular religion, but why some people live a fantasy (eg God) even though there are facts that refute this and abrade reveal (the burning of witches / stoned etc,)
If only one man believes he is considered mentally ill, many believe it, "you can call it religion." (Big screen;-))
What do you think?
2 people like this
13 responses
@kendedes2011 (2712)
• Indonesia
21 Jul 11
Oh, you have facts that there is no God?
Oh, you're the first in the world! Until now, no one could prove namely that there is no God!
One can experience God, but if you believe in Him.
And they are many!
What really has to do with burning witches or even the existence of God with God? God has never ordered the burning of witches!
Also, the Jews must have been mentally very sick (please do not misunderstand), because then they actually believed they would once again come back from the distraction in their own country. She even wrote it on a promise of God!
Funny is not it?
1 person likes this
@wmraul (2552)
• Bucharest, Romania
21 Jul 11
quote 1
God has never ordered the burning of witches!
end quote 1
quote 2
Oh, you have facts that there is no God?
end quote 2
Oh really?
Is hilarious. You challenge the topic starter to come with proofs of God non-existence, but how about you to come with proofs God did NOT ordered witch to be burned (and not only, science people were also burned ..)?
Oh, but do not come with the old "God love people, He can not order such thing", while IN HIS NAME were done billions of murders and he didn't strike back ...
PS: I am not atheist, I am agnostic. This mean I believe I existence of God. I do not believe in religion(s).
@wmraul (2552)
• Bucharest, Romania
21 Jul 11
@ smilingjack
Nope, my friend, agnosticism is or may be something different too. But the idea is that agnostics are not similar with atheists, simply because denying existence of God (atheism) is itself a religion, while agnosticism - as you pointed - is not.
That's for an agnostic will not belive in God as religions request. An agnostic is primarily against religions, yet I found myself many times considered equal with atheists, which is no way true.
And I doubt church was EVER the voice of God.
1 person likes this
@wmraul (2552)
• Bucharest, Romania
21 Jul 11
Despite I would love a long talk around the subject - as I am the bigest fan of Immanuel Kant - I would have to ask for a premature cease fire. My english if far to underdeveloped to rush into a deep meanings conversation. I must say I never learned english, I just know what I know from movies and lately, by using internet.
However, just as a preview of something will never be:
quote
Do you believe in Zeus ?
Hades ?
Ra ?
Mithras ?
Odin ?
Marduk ?
end quote
My answer:
Do I have to belive or disbelive in any or all of them? Should I care if they exist or not ?
Because basicaly, be those above and / or other Gods, whatever proof you'll bring in favour of an option, that will only show that there is another question to which there is no answer.
And I belive there always will be a new question without answer, aka denying complete knowledge, aka agnosticism.
@1hopefulman (45120)
• Canada
22 Jul 11
Can you prove that God is a fantasy? No! So maybe "no God" is the fantasy?
1 person likes this
@firstcontact1990 (1784)
•
26 Jul 11
Can you prove there is a God, can you prove that we aren't alone in this Universe. Religion is a Social Construction - it was created by people,whether there is a god, remains to be seen.
@1hopefulman (45120)
• Canada
28 Jul 11
I communicate daily with God and I have no doubt about his existence at all. If you are sincere I can guide you. The rest is up to God as to whether he wants to give you the proof that you individually will need. I have no doubt that he can bury you in proof. It will all depend on what's in your heart. He knows exactly what's there.
He has no need to prove anything to anyone but if you are a genuine lover of truth, of righteousness, of people, then he is more than happy to help you or anyone else who loves and cares. I only wish the best for you!
1 person likes this
@firstcontact1990 (1784)
•
26 Jul 11
I am an atheist, I do not believe in god. I was more of an agnostic as a naieve young kind, I am not 21 so, I am able to make up my own mind. I grew up in a family that isnt religious, but a family that would accept me if I chose to believe. There are a number of reasons I don't believe in a God. Ofcourse you can't really argue there is or there isnt a God. But then again, there is more evidence to suggest that we were born how Science says and not religion. But look at it this way, if thetre was a God in all his mercy, would he let us destroy the planet he supposedly created for all life to live on, would he let these mindless wars continue, would he let this distarous famine continue in Africa. But then, has he left us to our own devices?
Personally I am inclined to disbelieve in God, I haven't seen enough evidence to the contrary, and you cannot say that all the good people do is because of God, that is called Altruism.
After the negative publicity that some religions namely Islam and Catholocism has had over the years, do you really believe there is a god. Oh and one more thing, if there is only 1 God, why is there more than 1 religion, that is pointless.
1 person likes this
@buenavida (9984)
• Sweden
28 Jul 11
@1hopefulman, I was just going to answer this when I saw your response..
I think your explanatinon has covered the most of what a sincere person may need to start doing research and see what proof there is that we have a Creator with a plan for this earth and us humnan beings.
@firstcontact - you have many good questons!! , after 50 years of studying the nature and the Bible, I can only say that those who really want to find answers to their questions, can find them.
We just need to be humble enough to listen and learn and ask God for guidance.
As you may know, there are many scientists and biology researchers who believe there is a very wise Creator.
Here is a story of a nuclear scientist who after carefully researching the facts, found out that there is a God.
http://www.watchtower.org/e/20040122a/article_01.htm
@1hopefulman (45120)
• Canada
28 Jul 11
All fair questions. there is nothing wrong with questioning. Actually God invites them. That shows interest.
"But look at it this way, if thetre was a God in all his mercy, would he let us destroy the planet he supposedly created for all life to live on, would he let these mindless wars continue, would he let this distarous famine continue in Africa. But then, has he left us to our own devices?"
While it may look as if everything is out of control, I can assure you that everything is working according to plan and on schedule. Don't worry about the damage that has been done and will yet be done as God has the wisdom and power so that all is eventually repaired and restored to perfection once and for all time.
Think of a man that has only one child and how much time and patience it takes to teach this child to become a balanced adult. God has to deal with billions of people and issues that have been raised as to whether God is a just and loving ruler.
All the issues are being addressed to the satisfaction of all that are fair-minded. We are about to see some awesome events in the very near future.
It will take some time to answer everything as the issues have to do with justice and love. They cannot be rushed but the outcome is an earth filled with happy, loving, educated people that will live forever in paradise conditions.
1 person likes this
@barehugs (8973)
• Canada
21 Jul 11
You don't have enough faith," Jesus told them. "I tell you the truth, if you had faith even as small as a mustard seed, you could say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it would move. Nothing would be impossible."
Have you noticed lately, an absence of mountains in your vicinity?
This is because someone with the Faith of a Mustard Seed moved them all away!
1 person likes this
@sid556 (30959)
• United States
22 Jul 11
Wow. The original poster tosses out a seemingly simple question and everyone pounces. Great discussion. I have always questioned the authenticity of organized religions. As someone pointed out, the rules change as they go and they separate people. People argue over religion and start wars over religion. I grew up being pushed into a religion that I did not choose. It took up lots of my time as a kid and I hated it. I found it scary as a child and questionable as I grew older. As an adult, I don't subscribe to any particular religion and while my kids were exposed, they were not pushed into anything. Is there a God? Well, we can't prove whether there is or there isn't but with so many very intelligent people believing in a higher power of some sort, I can't deny the possibility. As for those that dont believe at all, well, all I can say is that they too could be right. Maybe if people just believe or don't believe and follow or don't follow a religion and worry only about how they themselves behave rather than trying to "save" the rest of the world, we'd all be in a better place.
@barehugs (8973)
• Canada
22 Jul 11
One of my beekeeping friends places a St. Christopher medal on the hive bottoms to protect, and keep her honey bees healthy and well. I explained to her, that if this St.Christopher medal worked, every beekeeper in the world would be using this medal,religiously. I told her that obviously this idea had no merit, because her winter losses with the medal, were no less than mine, without medals . "OH well," she said,"It makes me feel better anyway!"
@zerd87 (301)
• Philippines
22 Jul 11
God always exist. We are at the mercy of Him. If you think that there is no God then think it over and over again. By the time you die, you could say God help me and forgive me. That's the time you will beg on Him for mercy. So think that God our Lord Jesus always exist before its too late.
@bird123 (10643)
• United States
22 Jul 11
Forget everything you have ever learned about God. It's clear religions do not add up. They do not understand God. Let's start over. Let's use a bit of rational thought. If God exists, then God can be found. You will have proof of God when you find Him. Since God is a Spiritual Being, you will be hard pressed to supply physical proof to your friends, however you can point a direction by which those really wanting to discover the truth have the potential for doing so. Where to start?? Where does one start to look for God?? We must first assume God exists then look to discover the truth. You can tell much from anyone through their actions. Look around you. See God's actions. All the secrets of the universe stare us in the face. Funny how everything adds up. If all the physics add up so must the people factor. With many more variables, it's going to be much more complicated. With enough time and effort, one can discover God's actions. When you come to understand the how and why of things, you start to understand God. This will lead to doors and discovery. The journey of discovery takes lots of time and effort. Without understanding you will just come back confused by the experience. God is very very smart. That is why so few really understand. Many aren't even close to being ready to even choose this journey. For those that are, I point.. Sometimes those who search will find what they search for.
@bird123 (10643)
• United States
23 Jul 11
Simple, smilingjack. Why would you search for anything that you didn't assume existed?? Even the best science starts with a belief or an idea. Yes, physics does add up, however Understanding is the key to whether it adds up for you or not. As for variables, take a study in statistical math. The more you have; the more possible combinations. Figure out the variable of a mere 7 billion views and the possible combinations of interactions. Not singing, smilingjack, Pointing for those who are ready. It's not my intention to step your toes.
@wmraul (2552)
• Bucharest, Romania
21 Jul 11
The main problem is not that that God exist or not.
The issue is about the religions, which have been crossing the line between something to teach morality to people to something to enforce and force-education large amounts of peoples, using the influence the name of God have.
There is no connections between religions and God. Once, very long time a go, maybe was. Monks from Asian temples may know better.
But today, religions only connection with God is the name "God". But nothing else.
And if one step out of line and speak differently, sure is taken as "insane" ..
@BalthasarTheRat (656)
• United States
21 Jul 11
Seperating "God" and "religions", specifically organized religions, is a great way to begin the discussions of religious problems.
The existence of God falls down to definition of God. If you define God as everything that exists, then you cannot refute the existence of everything. If, instead, God is a petty man on a throne somewhere then you might have problems.
Villifying worshippers of any religion, however, is counter productive until you isolate specific problems with that religion. Many of them (all, some would argue have a positive side: encouraging humans to live better lives. If you flush the annoying and sometimes distasteful aspects out of a religion you are commiting the "Throwing out the Baby with the bathwater" mistake.
1 person likes this
@gengeni (3308)
• Indonesia
21 Jul 11
yes so it is to deny God in the greatest resistance, which may seem impossible, he in his love, wisdom and omnipotence, because the detection of love, but God caused the man to love, not force.
There will never give evidence for existence of God, because the evidence itself is a faith-compulsive, but it always goes to the "free" will.
Therefore, God requires only faith that the people can go light knowledge and power, while the resistance against His love is always only creates more confusion and darkness of the mind.
@_sketch_ (5742)
• United States
21 Jul 11
If something doesn't exist, can it be resisted? I do not believe in God and therefore not his love either, so I do not resist his love. I do not believe in it. Ever since I have stopped believing, my mind has actually been much more clear, and beyond that, my consciousness has been more intact and therefore I have been more at peace, closer to light.
You mentioned free will, yet God is supposed to punish those who do not believe in him or do not worship him. Seems hypocritical and cruel to me.
The idea of God has created this idea of good vs evil and people are against eachother, thinking that their idea is the only correct one and that we must fight evil or it will get us. This idea is just plain scary and seems like fear-mongering to me. Fear is not love. Christians have often used the phrase "good, god-fearing person." If one loves god, then they cannot fear him and noone would cause someone to fear them if they loved them. This is a paradox.
In conclusion, I very much disagree with your view that not believing in God creates confusion. Much confusion actually comes out of religion itself. I am not confused at all, mainly because my views are flexible and willing to change with new information I receive. Religion seems very stubborn to me and stubbornness is true resistance, resistance to change. Life is change. I choose life.
1 person likes this
@BalthasarTheRat (656)
• United States
21 Jul 11
I wonder if Creationists think Evolutionists are mentally ill?
The evil done in God's name does not refute the existence of such a being. Neither does misunderstanding of His role. We cannot, for instance KNOW that God doesn't like burning witches, that was just somebody's interprettation.
If there is a God, in the sense you mean, He would have to have one heck of a wicked sense of humor and/or bad case of "don't give a sh*t"
In truth, the fantasy of God you are expousing is no more plausible than it's opposite: the fantasy of a lack of God. A wise man might ask what fantasies are you living under, for we can only make a guess at what life means and then live to that guess. Just because some people's choice leans toward a God, does not mean they are wrong automatically.
@wmraul (2552)
• Bucharest, Romania
21 Jul 11
The big problem around is that:
Taking God as a being. As "something".
Friends, if God would have been a being, a something, we would have seen / feel / smell / hear Him by now.
We are made to think God is a something, an entity, by small age education we receive.
Mark Twain said once "what a fantastic creatures we humans would be if we woulnd be limited trough education".
Very few parents teach their kids to be open minded and leave the belive - not belive - whatever option for the child to decide on his own ...
So, back to the subject: Taking God as an entity, as something, be if being or as a force, this is the mistake. The "there is a God or there is no God" question is wrong, its what makes us to become separated and fight. And this 2 things (God is something, God is real - or the opposite) are inserted into our minds sine early age by education.
Instead of being teached HOW to do, the child is educated about WHAT to do.
1 person likes this
@wmraul (2552)
• Bucharest, Romania
21 Jul 11
Smiling, you hit the nail.
That's what I was intending to say, that God is not something, because we may lack the option to sence him. We cannot feel/see/blabla magnetism, nor gravity, even less the infrared or radio waves.
But those exist. Yet nobody could not sau radio wave are "something" ..
And of all, brain waves (remember telepathy?) are the less to be called something.
If there is a God, is not "something", there for we can not prove it is. Also can not prove is not.
This mean we should ignore the problem, while there is like well playied tic-tac-toe - no outcome, no result. We shpould move to next issue on the list and leave this God existence a side.
And also yes, a big yes, to the second part.
You named perfectly: is the (new?) form of racism. The classical "divide et impera". Alwasy was like that and so will be ...
@Rick1950 (1575)
• Lima, Peru
22 Jul 11
For me religion is the way leading us to God. Religion exists because the human being has lost the contact with God, but there would be no religion. The faith is believe at something or someone who can not be seen. What people can't perceive whit their senses, will be called fantasy.
@Rick1950 (1575)
• Lima, Peru
22 Jul 11
I haven't say that what you don't perceive with your senses isn't true, but in my opinion most people call fantasy what they doesn't see, hear, taste or smell, that is, what they doesn't perceive with their senses. For this reason there is lack of faith. Remember that Jesus said "the road to perdition is wide but the way to kingdom of heaven is hard and narrow"
@zerd87 (301)
• Philippines
22 Jul 11
I think i cannot agree with that. Religion is just the instrument so that you know God and it is not the way to God. It is your faith that will lead you to God. And Faith is believing on something that you experience in your life whether you have seen it or not. I think it is not true that if you cannot perceive it with your senses it is fantasy. For example Faith, Faith cannot be perceive with your senses you cannot touch, see or smell it but you just feel it. that's my opinion and Truth that I confes in my life.
@onlineside (81)
• Philippines
23 Jul 11
Religion it doest matter where you come from what religion are you from religion cannot save cannot help each one of us the important is your personal relationship with God you talk to him one on one every time just like your friend that beside you or a brother ans you can open up to him all your trouble and worries because He is only the one know about the thing that going to be happened to the future and the present.
@jadesin (2)
• United States
22 Jul 11
That last line is a really good point. You just need a group of people to all say they believe in the same thing and suddenly there's another idea we can't make fun of...lol. But seriously it's kind of sad really how defensive some people get about this topic. Jokes like that probably would've got me burned in midevil times...
1 person likes this