Which government is smaller?
By speakeasy
@speakeasy (4171)
United States
February 26, 2012 12:47pm CST
We hear a lot about needing a small government. One that does not interfere with people with a lot of rules and regulations. But, what actually constitutes a "smaller government".
Is a small government - one that allows businesses to offer anything they want in any combination they want even when it means denying the people who use their products the opportunity to basic services?
Is a small government - one that says if you sell this product it must have this feature available whether th epeople who use it decide to use that feature or not?
Personally, I think that a government that tells 5,767,306 businesses that IF they decide to offer this product, it must make a specific service available to people who use it is smaller than a government that tells 311,591,917 individuals that they may or may not have access to a basic service included in a product depending upon the beliefs of their employer. (Numbers are from the latest US census report).
Anything that actually affects a group that is less than 2% of the total population must be smaller than something that affects 100% of the population. So, why are people who support a smaller government fighting a regulation that only affects a small portion of the "less than 2%" who are against it?
2 people like this
3 responses
@knoodleknight18 (917)
• United States
26 Feb 12
My guess is you're talking about the issue of birth control being included with health care. Rationally yes, stomping on the feelings of the 2% for the greater good is not only prudent, but is less intrusive of the government to do. Furthermore that same 2% is against gay marriage and a host of other things that quite specifically require more, bigger government if they get their way.
Even if my guess is entirely off. I think the one that always businesses to to offer whatever they want even if denies people basic services is the smaller government. While we might not agree with what the business does, it requires no government. On the other hand, this other option may seem more favorable. I'll side with the side I generally dislike and agree that this isn't actually for the government to decide and legislating it would require the government to take action.
I believe what you've done here is actually exemplify in a greater fashion than I ever could the problem with government and the peoples expectations. This now common mindset is quite frankly the proliferation of big government. People no longer expect the government to mediate, they now feel that the government is responsible to do for them what they should be doing for themselves, to the detriment of everyone.
It's called a boycott. Unfortunately our now spineless society can no longer do anything for themselves and wants the government to do it for them. It's quite frankly disgusting and ruining our entire society. The worst part is most people are to ignorant to realize they pay for it either way. Either they buy a better product, or they pay the government to enforce a law and then pay more for the service or product, but force people who don't want the service to pay for it too, and force everyone to pay taxes for the legislation.
Quite frankly I see a government who forces this law as big government. About 20% of Americans don't even have health care and of those that not of all of them get it through their employers. So it's really a big lie. It's giving 311 million people health care, nor does it regulate all the businesses in the country as many of them don't offer health care. It forces a tiny change that makes health care once again cost more, women who have health care and don't need birth control are going to suck up the supply just because it comes with their package while poor women who need it will no longer be able to afford it, and more people are going to lose health insurance because they cost will yet again go up even if it's falsely justified. It's not only big government it's bad government.
@speakeasy (4171)
• United States
27 Feb 12
In this particular case, yes, I am talking about including contraception as a benefit in all insureance policies.
When the government said that an annual physical had to be included in all health care policies there was no problem with that even though it affected more people (prescription contraceptives, at this time, only affect adults females not mane or children and not all women can use them or want to use them so the cost of adding this service is much less). In addition, the cost of prescription contraceptives is much less than the cost of maternity care (both prenatal and the actual birth). Any insurance company that increases there rates "because of this provision" is just using it as a false justification to increase their profits.
Another part of the law aims to take care of those who do not have health insurance by 2014, if it is not struck down by the SUpreme Court as being unconstitutional.
In my opinion this is much smaller government than a government that either decress that every one is required to use contraceptives or one that states that no one may use contraceptives. This only says they have to be made available and it is up to the individual whether they want to use them or not.
It is similar to the law that requires hospitals to provide health care to anyone in critical condition regardless of their ability to pay. It harms no person and only bothers a very small percentage of the businesses affected by it.
1 person likes this
@knoodleknight18 (917)
• United States
27 Feb 12
I see you're point. From a personal standpoint I'm for everyone having easy access to birth control.
But I think it should be made free, like food stamps, to anyone who doesn't have insurance. The constant telling of business what they can and can't do is big government, the opposite of capitalism, and even freedom. Businesses should be able to choose what services they provide and people should be able to choose whether or not they want those services. I guarantee you if the people want it bad enough and government doesn't force it, people will start selling it just to make money.
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
1 Mar 12
"If every business was run ethically, I would agree with you; but, unfortunately, many businesses do not behave ethically"
And you have this bizarre belief that every GOVERNMENT it run ethically? Seriously, what country are you living in because there's no way that it's the US.
"only make laws that benefit the majority."
Nice to see you say that. Now everyone knows that you are anti-minority. Based on your statement we should have kept slavery. Obviously the majority benefited from that.
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
27 Feb 12
"Is a small government - one that allows businesses to offer anything they want in any combination they want even when it means denying the people who use their products the opportunity to basic services?"
Yes, but who is being denied the opportunity to basic services in your example? If it's the birth control issue, all they are being denied is FREE STUFF. My food, water, clothing, and home aren't free. Does that mean I am being denied an opportunity to basic services?
"Is a small government - one that says if you sell this product it must have this feature available whether th epeople who use it decide to use that feature or not?"
No, that is government controlling business and thus is not small government. Government force such things because they have a vested interest (campaign contributions) in making sure that the company providing the "feature" profits off the regulation.
"Anything that actually affects a group that is less than 2% of the total population must be smaller than something that affects 100% of the population."
That's a short-sighted and incomplete analysis. The issue at hand involves a president blatantly violating the US Constitution and violating the civil rights of a minority in this country. It's funny that after all this time people still don't mind stomping on the rights of a minority, even JUSTIFYING actions by saying the only ones suffering are minorities. If you're willing to stomp on the rights of one minority, what's to stop you from doing it to another?
"So, why are people who support a smaller government fighting a regulation that only affects a small portion of the "less than 2%" who are against it?"
There are plenty more than 2% against this crap. Polls show as much as 50% are against it. Regardless, public polls don't justify a president violating the constitution. There is a clear and organized process for amending the constitution and it doesn't involve a poll.
http://www.lifenews.com/2012/02/22/poll-americans-oppose-obama-birth-control-coverage-mandate/
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/02/16/cnn-poll-half-oppose-obama-birth-control-insurance-plan/
@sierras236 (2739)
• United States
27 Feb 12
If it were just a pure numbers game, then it still doesn't make sense. You are leaving out the biggest factor, cost. If that 2% of the population spent as much or more than the other 98% than does it really make that much financial sense to make a demand?
As Taskr36 said, you are basing your conclusions on incomplete data.
But this is more than a pure numbers game. There is still the Constitution and the First Amendment.
The issue is about the Government demanding something to be free. Let's not even assume that it is birth control but anything.
Anything that the Government demands to be free is going to cost someone (taxpayers, business, consumers, even the people who get it for free) more money. It isn't in the direct costs but the indirect costs where the fine print resides where you are paying more for a "free" item. So the big question is how is something "free" if you get charged regardless of whether or not you personally get that product?
Think about it like an interest payment. You are getting something for "free" every time you swipe your card. But at the end of the month, you are going to pay for it plus some even though the product itself was "free" at the time.
@speakeasy (4171)
• United States
27 Feb 12
Anything that the Government demands to be free is going to cost someone (taxpayers, business, consumers, even the people who get it for free) more money. - sorry but this is one thing that will NOT cost a single penny more.
1 - No tax dollars are required.
2 - Less than 25% of the people who have or get insurance will be using the benefit - it does not provide anything to men, shildren, or older women. The only ones it will provide a benefit to are women of child bearing age AND many of them will either not use the beneift because they want to have children, have religious beleifs that prohibit the use of contraceptives, or are physically unable to take them because of side affects. the cost of providing a years worth of contraceptives is only a fraction of the cost of providing maternity care (prenatal, delivery, and post natal); so, any insurance company that says they have to raise rates because of it is just ripping off the public to get higher profits.
Also, this does not violate anyone rights. It is not requiring people who are against contraception to take it. It is not keeping people who do beleive in contraception form receiving it. The ONLY ONES it is affecting is a small group of people who feel they have the right to FORCE others to abide by their beliefs.
If you walk into any hospital that is affiliated with any church group and privately ask ALL of the employees what they believe on this topic, you will find a wide range of beliefs. Many of the employees do not even belong to the same religion. That is why this law EXEMPTS actual church employees; but, does not exempt outside businesses that they run. In a church all the employees are church members; in the other businesses that the church is "affiliated with" they are NOT church members and should NOT be forced to abide by beleifs that they do not agree with. That would be violating the employees right to religious freedom!