Transexual woman to compete in Miss Universe Canada
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
Calgary, Alberta
April 3, 2012 4:57pm CST
This a controversial issue in Canada right now that started a debate. Well a contestant named Jenna Talackova is disqualified to compete in the Miss Canada Pageant because she is born in a man, In other words she is a transexual, she did a protest of discrimination because of it and it seemed like she won her case because the guidelines of the Miss Universe Canada didnt specify "Must be born female" I think they might change the rules next year so this wont happen again.
She is reinstated to compete for Miss Canada Pageant.
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In your own perception do you consider transexuals as real women? This issue reminds me of a case were another transexual is allowed to compete againts women in the Olympics.
Can you imagine how Biological women will feel if they lost to her.
It seemed like to avoid cases like this to happen again,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObFaWNYudAA
Its updated in primetime news she/he is allowed to compete
1 person likes this
11 responses
@jonnifc (1017)
• Philippines
4 Apr 12
I think, when it comes to pageants, all contestants should have no surgical enhancements at all. It doesn't include working out to make one sexy. That's not surgical. But I mean, all natural. It's supposed to be a celebration of the beauty of women, not how good science and technology is.
I agree with you regarding the athletics issue. You compete in according to what you were born as. But I wanna know. After a transexual surgery, is the patient supposed to take additional hormones to help the body suppress the "natural" hormones? For example, a man becomes a woman, he's supposed to take in more estrogen to make him more womanly?
3 people like this
@purplealabaster (22091)
• United States
4 Apr 12
Yes, the hormone levels need to be raised to help a person appear more "manly" or more "womanly" depending upon which gender they are. In fact, hormones are definitely a factor in helping to increase strength and muscle mass, which is one of the reasons that steroids are illegal in most (if not all) competitions. If the person's hormone level is the same as the "average" person competing in an event of the same gender, even if the person was born a man (or woman) and had surgery to change to a woman (or man), then I think that person should be allowed to compete in the event, because that person will not have any "natural" advantage over anyone else in the competition.
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
she got an overwhelming support that is why she is reinstated. I heard some transexuals are not getting work as fashion models and worked as women. The debate about her is really heated. I think she wont win though and its not because she is transexual, I mean she cant win transexual pageants... Thats the reason she competed againts women this time around.
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
so you will allow transexuals to compete againts women in Olympics?
@Cherish14 (2693)
• Philippines
4 Apr 12
hi there,
i have seen this on the news and i am not so comfortable about the fact that she will be considered to joining the Miss Universes pageant. because it doesn't see fair to all the girls who are there already. if they change the rules and regulations of the pageant that transsexual can join in pageants well respected as this, then in the next year, all the other transsexual will also be joining.
it is not that it is discriminating, but the fact that it is a pageant for women, real and born women.
1 person likes this
@purplealabaster (22091)
• United States
4 Apr 12
Why wouldn't it be fair to all the girls that are there already? Why should transsexuals joining the competition be so intimidating to "real" women, especially if these "real" women are so beautiful? I would think that it would be a truer test of their beauty if they could stand up and be judged against any woman who wanted to enter (whether that person was born a woman or not) than to limit the competition.
1 person likes this
@purplealabaster (22091)
• United States
4 Apr 12
Nope, I am not stressed in the least bit.
I understand that it is your opinion, and you have every right to express it. I was merely wondering why it would not be fair to other contestants if women that were not born as such were allowed to enter the competition. I do not see how it is unfair, especially since there seem to be very few "real" women entering competitions these days anyway ... most women who enter these contests are artificially enhanced in multiple ways, so how is a transsexual any different?
1 person likes this
@Cherish14 (2693)
• Philippines
4 Apr 12
are you stressed? hahaha
just saying what i think, that is my opinion. for something as the Miss Universe pageant, they have been implementing the same rules and regulations and for decades and then all of a sudden here it is, this issue. i know a lot of people thinks this is okay and that transsexuals can join, anyway they included her to Miss Canada pageant for the Miss Universe. i am just quite uncomfortable about the fact that she will be joining the Miss Universe when it is already stated that naturally born women are the only ones that can join.
1 person likes this
@secretbear (19448)
• Philippines
4 Apr 12
I don't have anything against transexuals but I must agree with the beauty pageant board. The requirements said the contestants must be female and by female it means, female inside and out. Sure, she did have organ transplant but I'm sure she doesn't have a uterus. I mean, it has always been understood that the requirement to be a female is to be biologically female. It has been the understanding from time immemorial. The fault of the board is just that they didn't anticipate to have a changed person. But I will go with the disqualification of that contestant. I'm sure the Board did not mean any discrimination.
Anyway, Ms. Talackova can still have other chances and the Board will have the chance to rectify its fault.
1 person likes this
@secretbear (19448)
• Philippines
10 Apr 12
She was reinstated? Wow. I did not expect the Board to change their decision. I don't agree in her reinstatement, unless the Board gave provisions in their requirements to allow transexuals to join the pageant. If they gave provisions in the requirements, then no one can question transexuals anymore in joining such pageants.
1 person likes this
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
11 Apr 12
You want to know a big shocker, By 2013, all trannies will be allowed to join Miss Universe now. soon I can see it,women will quit joining Miss Universe, and goes to Miss World and Earth, with Miss Universe have nothing but trannies.... well it can happen.
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
do you agree that they reinstated her? she is allowed to compete again. I think there is a double standard here, if a real woman competes in a transexual pageant, she will be disqualified and no one will complain.
@topffer (42156)
• France
4 Apr 12
I always thought that it is degrading for women that such contests exist, but I am amazed by the responses to this discussion. If transexual and hermaphrodites -- the Caster Semenya case -- are allowed to take part to sport competitions where they can be really advantaged by their hormones, I don't see why they should not be authorized to participate to a Miss contest... where they are not really advantaged by their hormones. I wish her good luck.
1 person likes this
@topffer (42156)
• France
4 Apr 12
Glorifying beauty is not wrong when it is done by a poet, but being judged publicly on body measurements like an animal in a fair is demeaning.
"Pageant girls are seen as saints here." Blessed are the poor in spirit. I remember that 2 or 3 years ago, a magazine gave the result of a general knowledge IQ test done on 20 candidates to the "Miss Switzerland" beauty contest : only 5 of these girls were average or above average. It seems that it is difficult to have a good brain and cute legs, or more probably women with good brains don't participate to these contests in Europe where they are depreciated.
It will be interesting to see how the jury will rate this particular candidate to the title of Miss Canada.
1 person likes this
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
i think ever since 2008, they dont allow girls here to compete if they were not suma cumlaude, Thats how its taken seriously here, they make sure the participant can answer the final question about world peace thingie.
By far still now working. I think the gloryfing in my country started when my country win pageants bajillions of decades ago. after that the government became obssesed with it. I Think the next Filipino woman to win Miss Universe can win the presidential elections if they do win. I heard there is even virginity test stuff cos they want the Phillippine representative to be pure, I know that sounds weird but that is how taken seriously here, weird as it may sound...
I think in Case of Venezuela(the most pageant obsessed country), which is like winning the crown regularly, Girls are trained since childhood. They were also forced to study Philosophy and some Psychology stuff so they can answer the final question.
1 person likes this
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
I think in Europe ,Muslim Countries except Indonesia, and I guess North America, Beauty pageants are seen as demeaning but In Asian Countries, Africa, Most 3rd world countries and Most of the Latin continents, beauty pageants are taken seriously.. In the US Girl joins pageants to be a model, In Venezuela I think, They join pageants to be a Politician.
You can also add Philippines to the list. Its like the only country where Heterosexual men watches pageants like they where watching Manny Pacquiao's match.
Pageant girls are seen as saints here.
I think in the end, they let her in so Miss Canada will have ratings.
2 people like this
@bhonti (1246)
• Philippines
3 Apr 12
I strongly disagree that the Ms. universe foundation will allow him/her to join the Ms. Universe pageant. If they let her in, this will make a great change to the pageant system. I just hope the gay people understand that this pageant is for real women only.
1 person likes this
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
3 Apr 12
some people fears that real women will quit joining Miss universe cos it will be dominated by trans. she is already reinstated to compete. I dont think she will win though, cos she is said to join multiple Transexual pageants and never won any of them. If she cant win againts her own kind, I dont think she can win againts real women. but who knows, she might win and change everything
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
People are still divided about the issue about her, It seemed like she have rich parents, cos she is able to hire a very expensive attorney.
@xanika (4)
• Philippines
4 Apr 12
i believe that a woman is legally defined as having the complete anatomical properties of a woman as such in her reproductive capacity to which she is able to bear a child in her womb. without this, she is not a complete woman but only in mind and heart. If she won in the Ms. Canada Universe, I think she'll be getting it harder in the screening for the Ms. Universe. I feel that it is unfair for a woman like me who thinks and feels as a woman purely for the world to believe that to myself I gained respect because I am honest. I deceived no one to get to where I want.
@purplealabaster (22091)
• United States
5 Apr 12
I can assure you that the definition of a woman has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not a person can bear a child in their womb as there are many people born with "female" genitalia that cannot conceive and/or carry a baby their womb, and I am sure they would be offended by someone saying that they were not "real women" as a result of this.
1 person likes this
@lacieice (2060)
• United States
4 Apr 12
According to dictionary.com, the basic definitation of woman is the nature, characteristics, or feelings often attributed to women; womanliness.
According to this, this person is indeed a woman, even though this person was not born a woman.
1 person likes this
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
I think she undergo hormone therapy at a very young age thats why there is no more traces of manliness in her, she actually resembles donald trump's daughter.
@chiyosan (30183)
• Philippines
4 Apr 12
I am not against any transexual person.. I am okay with them, live and let live - that is what i am all for. But when it comes to this, This person knows that she is born as a boy - with a man's organ and no uterus, etc
So why is he insisting on joining the contest that is intended for people born as a woman biologically.
We are talking about respect here, and well i am insulted myself, and as a woman... i am indeed insulted because we all know that the contest was for women, and not for transexuals, he losing his male organ, taking hormone pills did not make her grow a womb, and he is not even menstruating himself i believe he is not born as a woman.
I am taking the side of the organization here because he knows about it, and he knows that he can be booted out if they found out about his real gender... but he still joined and now feeling insulted because of what he wants to be. he wants to be a woman but that sure did not mean he is a woman, right?
I am all for them going out, it is their body after all, their life, but if they want respect, so does the straight people because they sure need to respect organizations that are not meant to belittle them, right? miss universe and miss country (x) these are here even before people decides or tries to discover who they are.
1 person likes this
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
Thats brave of you, since most people I encountered are supportive of her but yeah transexuals have their own pageants. They already have rights to get married and have protection againts discrimination but this case is for sure way too much, For almost century the pageant she wanted to join had always been for women. I think she can still pass to work as a model and book jobs over real women but joining a competition for women, I dont know. I think her case is not even under human rights,
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
3 Apr 12
i think a lot of people are automatically supporting her even though they don't like the idea cos they dont want to be called homophobic or transphobic. she have a huge disadvantage in the situation she puts into. I heard Trump want to change the reguirements so an incident like this wont happen again. she looks like a woman but her voice is still manly.
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
from what I know there is a law in canada that legally accepts transexuals as real women. That could be the factor why she won the case. I think they might make her win for the sake of publicity.
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
she kinda resembles Ivanka Trump who is like the Daughter of Miss Universe owner Donal Trump.
@NailTech (6874)
• United States
4 Apr 12
I am kind of torn on this one, but the majority of me wants to think the way I believe in. If you are born a female then you can compete. This "woman" was not a man to begin with. Perhaps if they made a transexual beauty pageant, and I'm sure they will one day, he will be a contestant on that one day. I'm not trying to be discriminating, it is just my belief.
1 person likes this
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
there are actually pageants for transexuals, They were huge in Thailand. She is said to competed in those cos she didnt win, so I guess because she cant win Transexual pageants, she is trying to win women's pageant instead. you wont see women in transexual pageants though.
@CaptAlbertWhisker (32748)
• Calgary, Alberta
4 Apr 12
I think Miss Canada will either fully allow transexuals next year or specify that she should be born woman.I think people who dont watch pageants are supportive of her and people who watches pageants dont like her.