Oblivious
By ladybugmagic
@ladybugmagic (3978)
United States
September 16, 2012 12:06pm CST
"We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers"
- Romney pollster Neil Newhouse
Are republicans actually oblivious to facts? Is it willful ignorance they all suffer from?
Throughout this political climate, on the forums I read, republicans tend to seem very ill informed and under-educated. They don't know who Noam Chomsky or Deepak Chopra are, they don't grasp satire at all, and in general, republican voters can't seem to let those pesky little facts get in the way of any issue, and I can't for the life of me understand why.
For instance, there is a proposed salt and soda ban/reduction in New York by the health department.
The libertarians and conservatives then foam at the mouth about how we should be able to make our own decisions about what we eat. Okay, fine, but look around. No one is making a good or healthy decision. Americans are obese. It is a pandemic. Childhood obesity and diabetes is at an all time high. It's clear that people are not making good choices for themselves or their children, which is akin to abuse when you let them eat so poorly that they obtain a condition from it.
That is why health departments are stepping in. They didn't just one day decide to become a dictator and forbid us a chocolate bar or big gulp. They can see what is around us and the devastation our eating habits are causing our children.
This year, we have had record droughts, record highs, snowfalls in summer, hurricanes and tornadoes in aberrant locations, and clear evidence of ocean levels rising. There is something wrong with the water cycle, and climate change is ever present, but there are so many republican deniers.
Antibiotic resistant superbugs and weed-killing resistant plants are spreading. That proves evolution and natural selection.
Abstinence-only teaching doesn't work. There are homosexuals in every species. Tax-paying citizens pay into entitlement programs in the event they have a downturn and need assistance.
It's just bizarre, when things are right there in front of you, and you can't see it for yourself.
There are dems like that, too, but, this is mainly a quality I have seen in the threads posted by republicans.
Lying Ryan is probably the perfect example.
1 person likes this
10 responses
@trruk1 (1028)
• United States
16 Sep 12
Facts would be an impediment to proclaiming ideology--if they were bothered by facts. If the facts conflict with the ideology, the facts must be wrong. They still aver that supply-side economics (also called "trickle-down" economics or, as George H.W. Bush once called it, "voodoo economics") benefits everybody, despite clear evidence that it does not. Romney and Ryan simply create their own "facts" and use them for self-promotion. Ryan has repeatedly blamed Obama for the closing of an auto plant in his district, despite the fact (which he knows) that it closed while Bush was still in office.
2 people like this
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
17 Sep 12
The plant closed on April 23, 2009. That is a FACT. Sure the plant was on the downhill spiral before that. That's why Obama made his speech there in 2008, pretending he could save it. The fact is, he could not and he was lying by pretending that he, or anyone else, could.
http://articles.cnn.com/2012-08-30/politics/politics_pol-fact-check-ryan-gm_1_gm-plant-president-obama-barack-obama/2
Both sides misrepresent facts. People like you and ladybug just pretend that your side is oh so honest despite the obvious lies.
@trruk1 (1028)
• United States
17 Sep 12
The final decision to close the plant was made in December 2008. It takes time to shut down an operation like that. Finding a nitpicky detail is not an effective way to defend an indefensible point of view. The plant began to close in 2008. It took a few months to finish it.
1 person likes this
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
17 Sep 12
"despite the fact (which he knows) that it closed while Bush was still in office."
So you admit that this is a lie then right? If you wanted to tell the truth, you would have stated that plans to close it were in effect before Obama took office, not that it closed before Obama took office. You do know that just because something plans to close that doesn't always mean it happens right?
@AidaLily (1450)
• United States
16 Sep 12
They are actually oblivious to facts and some of them, at least the ones I have come across, are poorly educated or they have no idea about the world around them. Most of them do live in areas where there is either a poorer education system or in small communities in which they still don't see much.
Most of them are also emotionally driven which means if you attack something they are super emotional about all logic and reason goes out the window. That is a psychologically proven fact that you can not be logical and overly emotional at the same time. I mean Mitt Romney himself could come up to these people and tell them that he plans to make so they can't afford to survive and take away the few jobs they have right before he then states that he is going lower the deficit, and they would still vote for him. Their emotions have clouded any opposite argument just like the clear evidence of the climate changes.
Not saying the left doesn't do some of this, but it is more prominent in the GOP that they will go after emotionally charged, less educated voters because those are GUARANTEED votes. They don't have to prove a thing to those voters, they just need to scare them. It is an effective tactic to say the least.
2 people like this
@crossbones27 (49432)
• Mojave, California
17 Sep 12
I agree withe every thing you said but their are also many religious schools that the right sends their children to that rewrite history and teach their own made up science. So I imagine keeping an open mind for these children is out of the question.
1 person likes this
@burrito88 (2774)
• United States
16 Sep 12
Yes they worship the name of Reagan because of trickle down economics and the fact that he engineered the largest tax cut in America's history. Yet trickle down economics only trickled out and shortly after the tax cut Reagan initiated the biggest tax increase in America'a history (they just called it closing loopholes.) They believe Reagan ended Communism instead of Communism merely collapsing under it's own weight. (And has Communism really ended in Russia with Putin in charge?) They ignore that Iran-Contra occurred on Reagan's watch yet they want to blame Obama for everything.
Then you have Republican's like Rick Santorum who believes that abortion is responsible for the Social Security crisus. Yet all those aborted babies would now be working and helping to pay into Social Security according to Rick, who seemed to have forgotten about the high unemployment rate. But what can you expect from someone who believes that higher carbon dioxide levels are good. A To paraphrase him, plants like carbon dioxide. Gee, how did he lose the nomination.
1 person likes this
@irisheyes (4370)
• United States
18 Sep 12
It's hard to believe that there are people still touting "Trickle Down" economics after what we saw in 2008. The only things that ever tricled down in the Reagan years were minimum wage service jobs with no benefits that took away every middle class dream of home ownership or college for kids. The truth is that most people working for $7.50 an hour cannot even afford a car or vet bills for a pet.In fact those jobs are not even trickling down anymore. They are being outsourced. Yet they still point to the enormous sucess of Trickle Down.
I don't think we just need another four years of Obama. I think we need four more years of Obama plus another eight years of the next Democrat to run. Maybe by then the Republicans will be able to come up with something better than Romney.
@crossbones27 (49432)
• Mojave, California
17 Sep 12
Rick Santorum also believes if everyone gets married, then no one would ever be in poverty. When the facts prove otherwise, many marriages end in divorce over poverty.
1 person likes this
@sierras236 (2739)
• United States
18 Sep 12
All of the world's economy is "trickle down." There is no other way to produce income and jobs if it doesn't "Trickle down" from somewhere.
Apple got rich because of "trickle down" and a producing a product that people want. They had bank loans, and investors.
What other type of economy is there besides "trickle down?"
There certainly isn't a "trickle up" economy because no one has money at the bottom.
I suppose there might be a "trickle sideways" type of economy.
All Government programs are "Trickle down." As evidenced by the $16 Trillion dollar debt that keeps piling up.
Even Clinton's economy was "trickle down."
You really don't need another 4 years of Democrats because the only thing that they got done in the 2 years they had office was a health insurance plan that flopped on many fronts. It is sad that they couldn't even pass a Budget.
@lelin1123 (15595)
• Puerto Rico
17 Sep 12
I call it not having a bit of common sense! If you have common sense you see what is the truth and what is not. I know I want the truths and don't what to hear the lies. So when you go back and research you learn who is telling the truth and who are telling lies. I see republicans living in a world where they are blind by so much around them. They don't want to see or learn the truth. I think it is a very scary way to live their lives. Believing what is so obliviously not true is really ridiculous to me. Like people still believing that President Obama was not born in this country.
@crossbones27 (49432)
• Mojave, California
17 Sep 12
I think many conservatives believe that smart people are just trying to outwit the people who are not not as smart. They think they are just telling lies so they can either scare people or just get their way in some devious way. I like to use climate change as an example. They think many scientist have made up that the planet is warming and the glaciers are all melting so they can get more funding for their work.
While they may be some people who use their smarts to out manipulate people. It does not take a rocket scientist to go outdoors or take a little vacation in the outdoors somewhere and notice things seem to be a changing. This is where people need to use some freaking common sense and check things out for themselves if they do not believe certain things. Its really not the hard to call BS.
The problem I see is that the conservatives who do try this approach, they themselves are trying to manipulate the issue into their point of view so they can get what they want. Its not well do they have a point and if they do, what can I do to make it better? Its more like, they do have a point and what can I do to discredit that point by any means necessary. They know what they are doing. I do not think conservatives are stupid. I think many of them just do not care about anything except money and power. They would rather come across as stupid as long as they have fat wallets.
1 person likes this
@crossbones27 (49432)
• Mojave, California
17 Sep 12
The sad thing is obviously half the country falls for this type of rhetoric. I think it mostly has to do with that people think for some reason that Republicans are the economic gurus of the country. Just because their philosophy is to never raise taxes and they don't believe in regulations. Plus they want make everything about profit.
If you ask me, making everything about profit is why we are in this mess. We neglect so many important tasks that absolutely need to be done for our country to thrive. Why, because it is not profitable. Eventually that stuff starts to catch up to you and you end up where we are.
Yet, time and time again, half of the country thinks that the right wing are better at handling the economy than everyone else. To me its not about logic with these types of people, its about greed. That is why the right can say what ever they want and get away with it. It puts money in their pockets while the rest of the country goes to crap.
2 people like this
@sierras236 (2739)
• United States
17 Sep 12
So let's talk oblivious...
President Obama is oblivious to the fact that Obamacare won't raise health care costs, said so himself. This is regardless of the fact that there is a collective agreement that it has done nothing to keep costs down. Another oblivious fact that you can keep your own doctor's and insurance plan.
President Obama is oblivious to the amount of money he is actually spending. Regardless of the fact that the National debt was at $10 trillion at the start of his Presidency (Yes, I count 2009.) and the fact that it is now surpassing $16 Trillion and fast approaching the total GDP. Oh yeah, there is still NO Federal Budget (another verifiable fact))/
President Obama is oblivious about the real reason the Middle East is rioting. As evidenced by the failure of total evacuation orders from the embassy and the very late warnings issued by the President to get out. Those warnings should have come immediately.
President Obama is oblivious to what the Fed is actually doing. Printing money is the number one cause of inflation. Too much money in the system ultimately hurts both the poor and those unemployed. It ultimately hurts State budgets, and there are more major cuts in the works for many States. It is a fact. Go look at what the States are doing.
I could go on... But such obliviousness isn't just on the right. But then again, I think the left likes to hold onto their disillusions especially if they plan on a second term for this President with a very likely even more uncooperative Congress than he has now.
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
17 Sep 12
I had to analyse the educational make-up of our two main political parties here for my PhD thesis, and some interesting figures popped up. About 2 in 3 on the conservative side have "rational" education, law, economics, engineering, and the remainder have no tertiary education at all; the "liberal" side has as many law and economics graduates, but the vast majority of them, plus many others in the party, have Arts degrees to go along with and "soften" their "rational" qualifications. Most of the rest have teaching degrees, and a far higher proportion overall have advanced education.
Conservatives seem to avoid any education that isn't rationally goal oriented, and many fear education because it leads to radical thought. This fear of education also appears in traditional religion, where, in some forms, even an educated minister is somewhat suspect, since the only book one ever needs to read is the Bible. It's no coincidence that conservative politics has such strong ties to conservative religion.
John Stuart Mill once said, "You don't have to be stupid to be a conservative, but most conservatives are stupid."
Lash
@debrakcarey (19887)
• United States
16 Sep 12
Yea, so bizare the things people overlook, the things they believe. And to think Democrats know it all. wow, thanks for letting me in on the secret. NOT
@eagletrek2 (5499)
• Kingston, New York
17 Sep 12
Hi I agree with every thing
You said it like Saturday night TV
Show will not need writers
This year all the prodcer need
To do is.watch the Republican party
It like watching Saturday night live TV lol
