Its again about rape...difference between consent and lack of it...
By vanny
@vandana7 (100282)
India
January 10, 2013 11:21am CST
So...Nalsar ...the law institute here wants to amend rape laws...as if we didnt know they were biased.
So they want to say a rape would not be a rape if there is consent to it...
Good...theoretically.
Now...with recent propaganda that the brutal rape has received and all previous and new rapes that have been discussed in media ...
any girl who gets into that kind of situation...is more likely to think..if I survive this...without a few rods in me and without my intestines falling apart, I will be ok...why should I protest..thereby making the rapist feel more powerful and victorious by beating me.
Or be too stunned out of wits...to even think of ...fear...
So would you say consent exists when
a. the girl does not resist ...initially because her brain stops functioning due to fear
b. the girl wants to escape injuries of the kind the December 16th raped kid had..
c. the girl surrenders because there is some threat to her near and dear ones
d. the girl surrenders because there is a promise of marriage
I would be glad if you could use give answers as a, b, c, and d ..
3 people like this
8 responses
@PointlessQuestions (15397)
• United States
10 Jan 13
It's a bogus answer. None of that excuses the rape. These ridiculous ideas has to be thought up by men who don't want to see men punishes for such a brutal crime. Women just aren't valued. From what you described being done to this girl, the Good Old Boys over there must not think much if their own mothers, daughters and sisters. If they thought one minute how horrendous this would be for them, they would define better what consent is. No o e consents to be raped. It's a contradiction in terms, being that rape is a violent act. How about rapes of makes? Are they as stringing to allow for consent of rape of males?
I don't mean to sound angry, but it makes me angry that women are so not valued.
1 person likes this
@vandana7 (100282)
• India
10 Jan 13
I too felt that way PointlessQuestions...
Consent..if conditional..whatever be the condition...should make it a rape...I feel.
If the girl consents so that the man does not hurt her, then it is a rape.
So..there is a condition...and therefore, it is a rape...
@dawnald (85146)
• Shingle Springs, California
10 Jan 13
Consent is when the girl is involved willingly. It is not consent when it is under duress.
@dawnald (85146)
• Shingle Springs, California
10 Jan 13
Absolutely, it's no different that a robbery victim handing over his money for fear of being hurt. You can argue that he handed over the money willingly, but he wouldn't have done so if there were no danger to him.
@hora_fugit (5862)
• India
12 Jan 13
I wanted to talk about option d but surely writing all that on mobile will drive me mad!
It's absurd that an underage boy promises an underage girl he will marry her ans she believes. Later the boy says he won't, the girl gets angry and jumps from her building! There was an accusation of rape as well but I will not go there because 'consent' itself was based on shaky grounds.
Marriage is about a lot of things and depends, at least here, on a lot of factors. How can you rely on a simple "I will marry you"? 
My friend was kind of feminist, talking about ways to help their cause. Then his breakup with his girlfriend turned him against the girls. I don't know the details, he won't tell me. However bitter it might be, I was deeply disappointed! Boys really need to be educated well...
I am not a feminist so don't like it when I find girls are relatively smart. Hence I add here : girls should be educated too 
My friend was kind of feminist, talking about ways to help their cause. Then his breakup with his girlfriend turned him against the girls. I don't know the details, he won't tell me. However bitter it might be, I was deeply disappointed! Boys really need to be educated well...
I am not a feminist so don't like it when I find girls are relatively smart. Hence I add here : girls should be educated too @hora_fugit (5862)
• India
12 Jan 13
Such promises could be made with pure honesty but later broken due to unavoidable circumstances... because again marriage depends on a lot of factors besides love.
But if such promise is offered as a condition, the girl should indeed get it in writing 
It'sad... long ago we had damsels in distress who were trapped by demons or evil witches. Princes came to rescue them. Now we have damsels in distress because they are not getting married. Princes do come to save them, but are they trustworthy?
It'sad... long ago we had damsels in distress who were trapped by demons or evil witches. Princes came to rescue them. Now we have damsels in distress because they are not getting married. Princes do come to save them, but are they trustworthy?
@vandana7 (100282)
• India
13 Jan 13
But how is it possible to say consent exists or does not...
In the past so many innocent girls and ladies have suffered because they have not been able to prove their lack of consent. Because of this, I am inclined to let a few "innocent"? men get the label of rapists..rather than doubt the words of the girl, even though the possibility of men being trapped increases.
1 person likes this
@maygodblessu44 (7336)
• India
11 Jan 13
Hello my friend vandana7 Ji,
Well, I would only say taht girls are to be parented/brought up like those "RANI LAXMI BAI OF JHANSI /RANI CHENNAMA" and many more. Why females are subjected to show taht tehy are females and not males. It is a vast topic and I keep myself reserved. It is only parenting that causes all such things to happen.
May God bless You and have a great time
@vandana7 (100282)
• India
11 Jan 13
It is not parenting the girls, it is parenting the boys that is going wrong, if you ask me.
Even Rani Laxmi Bai could not have expected and experienced this kind of brutality...that Nirbhaya underwent, I think it was because she resisted and called them names possibly...
1 person likes this
@vandana7 (100282)
• India
12 Jan 13
I think Indian women tend to over regard their male progeny because
a. They think the boy will be the earning member so he deserves that regard from the day he is born..as if earnings of girls are of no consequence.
b. They think the boy will look after them, because that is the society norm, even though this norm has been defied several times over and most elderly folks know it.
c. They think the boy will get a hefty dowry so their old age would be better; they will get to wear better clothes, and travel
d. They are told by tradition that they will go to heaven if the boy lites their pyre...an unconfirmed fact.
Strangely, girls who until marriage and pregnancy are as meek as a cow turn into different persons once they bear a son...dominating, and showing off type...
Yes, women turn against women in such cases because they become anti daughters in law. If the daughters in law are earning members, then the tale gets reversed.
1 person likes this
@vandana7 (100282)
• India
12 Jan 13
Would you say that the abov ereasons that I mentioned are wrong? :)
I for one...feel it is better if parents are looked after by their daughters than sons. Daughters would certainly do a better job when compared to daughters in law. Mother would not be able to complain about her own child, and therefore, half the politics and unnecessary hatred and fights would come down. Daughters too would benefit because their mothers would adjust to a lot of things that their own mothers in law would not. Moreover, they escape sisters in law harassment. :)
Just a logical suggestion, though I know it will never be implemented during my lifetime. :)
1 person likes this
@Sreekala (34312)
• India
11 Jan 13
In my opinion any girl will resist irrespective of the fact to get injured or not. If one is not resist that means she is willing where the word rape is not suitable at all.
Why on rape, if travel in a bus and anybody touch us knowingly or unknowingly how we feel, we feel like a centipede or millipede crawls on, will feel that much ugly. This is the general thinking of a normal girl/lady.
I agree, the recent rape is forcing the world to discuss and make necessary Laws to protect woman.
The ugly fact is, we are losing the humanity in us. If anybody would ready to help that girl in time she should have survived, the hospital staff has taken serious steps when on her admission in hospital she would have survived. She is not a victim of rape but the cruelty of other people who forget about the value of a life and simply engaged in arguments. Like the rapists who refused to help her also come under the category of culprits.
@vandana7 (100282)
• India
11 Jan 13
Resist ..yes...but fear might force her to compromise...dont judge by our standards...not everybody can afford hefty medical bills, and there are obligations that might make a girl think, what if I am injured badly...can my family afford medical bills and legal bills at this stage?
But even before that...panic can strike...depending upon the nature of the girl, and in panic...the girl would not really understand what to do or how to escape before it is too late. Anxiety and panic attacks are very very common in such stages. Most people would initially feel it cant be happening to me, it cant be happening in these days and times...and so on.
@thesids (22180)
• Bhubaneswar, India
11 Jan 13
If et all they could clearly define consent, marital rapes would never have happened...
The problem is that neither the males nor the females at these law making agencies understand why these rapes happen nor they are willing to try to understand those reasons. And as such, all we can expect is some confused statements, loopholed laws or anything which would only add to the confusion...
@vandana7 (100282)
• India
11 Jan 13
I agree...I have folks who say it is the duty of the woman. Come on, if the husband is tired, he gets to say no, but not the wife? If she is upset over some issue during the day, she cant be very much in "mood" can she?
And there can be several reasons such as health issues...and differences with the spouse.
Why are women who are married to drunkards who do not provide for them expected to do their duties...while drunkards are not forced by the society to provide for their families? Likewise, gamblers and other people who do not want to work...
There is so much discrimination that I dont mind the tables turned the other way now...
