Democracy vs. anti-national
By vanny
@vandana7 (100168)
India
February 10, 2016 5:28pm CST
I am no good in differentiation.
But in yesterday's incident, I thought it was obvious.
The students in JNU (India) wanted to air a documentary that portrayed one of the convicted terrorists as a martyr. By doing that, they were questioning the judicial system in the country, which I personally feel has many failings.
Have I not questioned those decisions before? Does that make me anti-national?
What is material is should that documentary have been aired once a person has been convicted and hanged?
Let us look at the other end of the spectrum; Gandhiji's assassin, Nathuram Godse.
Does the world not know enough about him? There are many who think Godse was right!
So if students in JNU desirous of supporting Afzal Guru the terrorist are wrong, why those who support Godse not wrong? After all, Godse killed a great man and he too was convicted and hanged?
Would that be anti-national?
The only anti-national thing I felt about these students was that they openly said they will break India into 10 different pieces. That - certainly was anti national.
Screening of documentary would not have been objectionable to me. If students are weak in mind they will be misled anyway and easily. But if they watch such documentaries they can rationalize better perhaps.
12 people like this
11 responses
@mk6195 (65)
• Bilaspur, India
11 Feb 16
Yesterday's event @JNU has raised one very issue the use of "Democratic Freedom" as citizens of largest democracy of the world, we should also not ignore the fact that to protect this democratic freedom is also the our responsibility.
We cannot ignore the fact that Afzal Guru was a terrorist and his justice has been done accordingly in preview of the Indian Constitution. Like any other person he has also been provided ample time and resources to defend himself at the court (frankly speaking he has been given more resources than a common man in India has access to) making a Martyr out of him is a direct mockery of our courts and justice system.
The people who had the audacity of organisation of such an event had clearly shown they don't respect the constitution int he name of democratic freedom given to them by the same constitution.
Comparison of Afzal Guru and Nathuram Godse is as absurd as the Event @JNU, Nathuram's Crime can be considered a crime of passion, for his hatred towards Gandhi Ji, his act can be considered a Criminal act not anti national for like every Indian he would have loved his country (his ideology may be different) he had acted towards a person not our country. His justice has been done in the exact manner in which any other citizen case i.e as per the Laws defined by the constitution of India.
On the other hand Afzal Guru has acted against the Country and its citizens.
4 people like this
@vandana7 (100168)
• India
15 Feb 16
@mk6195 ..I read some of the articles like this and am shocked
If India is not fast approaching into being rape nation of the world, in other regions, I would have had some doubts in believing it. Nobody ruins the reputation of women like that...militants or not...
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to: navigation, search Human rights abuses in Jammu and Kashmir Notes 1990 1991 1993 1996 1997 1998 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2006 2008 2009 2010 2013 The Kunan Poshpora incident is alleged to have occurred on Febr
2 people like this
@mk6195 (65)
• Bilaspur, India
15 Feb 16
@vandana7 Kashmir has been given Special Rights in accordance with requirement of Area in question. Just like we have Union territory and states each are to a limit Independent to make their polices and programs as required by their people. So giving special stature to a state entirely depends on the need. Because of Article 370 the J&K has become to a degree Autonomous State with limited Interference in Governance. Which was for the benefit of the people and it was temporary till the a State Constitution can be formed (the body responsible for this task.
The king has given kingdom but the people continue to have rights is true i completely agree with you, if the people of Kashmir were against the King's decision why the Pak Army with the Pastoon Mujahadin attacked the then Kingdom of Kashmir, that led to the Indo Pak war of 1947. The UN has to interfere for the Peace. Kashmir was a peaceful region till 80's (It used to be call heaven) when the terrorist attacks begin, the reason can be find reviewing the political leadership of Pakistan since 1947, it is mostly ruled by the Pak Army Under a Dictatorship........
Your last comment has personally hurt me @vandana7 because you have accused the entire Indian Army of Rape and Murder....................
There may be a few incidents of these nature but you cannot conclude the entire Army is involved in such actions. You will find Bad Apples in Every Lot but you cannot stereotype an entire group for the actions.... We hear and see such news all the time from all the parts of the world but is wrong to accuse all for some.
Because of the Terrorist Attacks can we comment all Muslims are Terrorist, NO WE CANNOT.... Some of My best friends are Muslims and they hate terrorist as much I Do..... Similarly We cannot say the whole army is bad but its true some incidents of such nature has occurred and not just the army but as an Indian I am also ashamed for that.....................
4 people like this
@artemeis (4194)
• China
13 Feb 16
In any form of governance other than dictatorship or tyranny I feel that news worthy and thought provoking documentaries are acceptable and mandatory. The real purpose isn't to rile up sentiments to cause any disruption or disturbance to the running of the country nor its economy to become a national security issue.
I feel that such documentaries are necessary since chastisment is a form of open audit on the current government's performance and creates an opening for issues to be resolved through necessary changes or implementations. It is for the better good since the documentary is based on proven facts.
There is nothing anti-national or putting the country at risk here. However, the host should do enough research to make the documentary approved. It should not be bias or carelessly construed to mislead the mass.
4 people like this
@marguicha (222615)
• Chile
17 Feb 16
This is a post I will have to read again while I also learn more about your country. It is difficult for me even to understand indian movies. As for freedom of speech, I´m for it unless they help create violence. The line is SO thin!
3 people like this
@thesids (22180)
• Bhubaneswar, India
11 Feb 16
I tend to agree with this not being telecast or aired.
Comparing Godse and Afzal for "anti national" is inappropriate because of the fact that back then, there were no terrorists and the term was not known (at least in the Indian Context). He was an assassin and let it be that way. Yes, I tend to agree with what Godse did because almost everyone who knows those days, and has a brain and is not so inclined to what they preach - realizes that Gandhi had lost it. He had to go, just that the way was wrong.
What Afzal did, was blatant act of terrorism - and it did indicate the loopholes in the security of one of the Nation's most secured zones - the Parliament. Now, if you relate, the breach of insecurity simply indicates the inefficiency of our Agents, Intelligence and also the Security Cover. Also note that on the Manifesto of BJP during the general elections, they did have a point to scrape off the J&K Article (this too can be a playing factor).
I do not know what that documentary contains, but reading this discussion only, I do realize that if this documentary goes on air in such times, it can spread more bad than do any good. Right now, India is not in need of such documentaries - mostly because the irrationals are more at large and they will leave no stone unturned to make use of this documentary to suite their needs and spread more unhealthiness.
Right now,we even dont seem to have a freedom to speech even though we are only speaking our inner fears with no other intentions (recall Aamir Khan controversy - which I state again, is a fear that many Muslim brothers and even a few Hindus in India suffer from at this moment).
3 people like this
@vandana7 (100168)
• India
11 Feb 16
Netaji was thought of as terrorist by the British and so also Bhagat Singh and others. It is perception from those that rule. We are also limited by our knowledge at any point of time. What we heard and condemned Godse and Afzal Guru was for what had been presented to us. Being open to another person's perspective and then reviewing where we stand may lead to more accurate solutions, which may actually be something that is being prevented by politicians. Both sides of the stories need to be heard by us too and not merely the judges. We each have our ability to decide what is right and what is not. Let us just say...100 Muslim students in a group of 500. If we block our minds 400 other students are not going to stray anyway even if the guy is being shown as a martyr presuming all 100 muslims do believe he is right. Then where is the fear? Unless there is possibility of that 400 strength decreasing.
3 people like this
@thesids (22180)
• Bhubaneswar, India
11 Feb 16
@vandana7 When I said terrorist in Indian Context - I did mean we Indians using that word for our people or others. British back then, had branded many of our Freedom Fighters as Terrorists - though the definitions of terrorists might have changed over time.
I agree with that 400 and 100 thing. But then, looking around makes me feel only pessimistic. It takes only a small bunch of leaders (1000? 2000? maybe 5000? in a country of 1.2 billion) spread all the differences between people on the basis of religion and what not. Again, only a small bunch of people create those terror outfits and the world suffers. Similarly, only a very small bunch of people get to one side and do the world war.
Definitely, being open and listening to both sides will have a plus point and also might clear the air better, but then, are we in this era that mature enough to give the different views any worthwhile thought? Most of those who matter (or could matter) will turn a deaf ear and it will be another fodder for the Media, Politicians and many others (maybe the entire nation) will suffer. I think it should wait.
5 people like this
@vandana7 (100168)
• India
11 Feb 16
I do not understand how a documentary that gives Afzal guru's version amount to a threat to national security. We get to listen to their point of view too, only then we get to reflect if we are going wrong somewhere. Without seeing the documentary how did the student think he was being portrayed as a martyr? The only seditious thing that I felt was immensely objectionable was stating that India will be broken down into 10 different parts..that was indeed bad and that alone should have sufficed to send those students behind bars without any recourse to law. But as far as documentary is concerned, we need to develop rational thinking, especially students. Unless they look at both sides of the coin how are they likely to do that?
3 people like this
@vandana7 (100168)
• India
11 Feb 16
@shshiju ..I am inclined to say there are many things that censor boards should not be clearing. History and mythology distortion in television serials for example. As to court, I was surprised by decision on December 16 minor's case...and also surprised by LGBT decision before that...Apex court is filled with seniors as judges who are possibly unwilling to move forward.
2 people like this
@hora_fugit (5863)
• India
21 Feb 16
Does the world not know enough about him? (Godse)
Does it? How much do we know? I wonder how he is used as an epitome of anti-nationalism for a one-off act. Or if Gandhiji was the nation.
1 person likes this
@TheHorse (218240)
• Walnut Creek, California
12 Feb 16
I'm not sure I understand the distinction. But don't like the idea of supporting terrorists. In America, naive students (and others) often support criminals as a way of objecting to what they perceive as (or are falsely led by the media to believe is) police brutality.
2 people like this
@Daljinder (23236)
• Bangalore, India
19 Feb 16
Lol…. I was wondering if you had brought up this topic on to debate or not and VOILA…there you are. I went through all the comments and my you do know how to stir up a real discussion. It was all very informative.
So its my turn now….eh?
I agree with @mkj on stereotyping everyone on the basis of the wrong done by some of them.
BUT I do not condone rape or violence of any kind AT ALL. Defense or not they should be punished severely. And those who try to cover it up should be punished DOUBLY harsh because the cover-up is ALWAYS worse than the crime. By doing that they are supporting the criminals and promoting the crime. This only encourages the wrongdoers. They become fearless and braver when going to repeat the crime since they know they had solid back from the sleuths of the defense of the country itself. So, why fear anyone?
I pity the women and children of such personnel who have to actually live with such low lives. I sympathize with the victims and am disgusted even ashamed by those who look down upon them for the horror done against them.
This brings me to the rights of women. Well the law states many things. But what use are they when no one implements it or use it? The law in such case is just that STATEMENT.
I mean look around yourself just for a moment and tell me how many girls took their parents to court for the right on father’s property? How many women suffering from domestic violence raised her voice and got justice? And also NOTE that how many of them were NOT looked down upon for fighting for their rights? When a women walks down this road our OWN society put them under the category of “ILL-REPUTE”. We warn our daughters and women to stay away from them and tell them that what they are doing is wrong.
WHAT THE HELL? Should I continue on?
Do you remember @Vandana when you brought up that news about a mob stripping and beating a foreign girl? It happened not even maybe 12 days after we celebrated our REPUBLIC DAY. The day when every INDIAN feels proud and boastful of their nationality and of their Nation. The day we INDIANS so enthusiastically wait for the PARADE to commence. A day to feel proud of our achievements, to honour the brave hearts, to witness the DIVERSITY and to celebrate it all.
Lol….. It all felt as a joke when you reported that incident here on myLot. I felt like the lowest of low for just being an INDIAN. I never felt more insecure and unsafe at that moment.
As a daughter of this Nation itself, I felt so very ashamed and disgusted when I read that my OWN BROTHERS, FATHERS, FRIENDS and all just SHED their DIGNITIES behind and committed such atrocious act.
The same people who go to the HOLY SHRINES and BOW their HEADS in front of the GODDESS they call their MOTHER and WORSHIP her. The same people who believe that every girl is an EMBODIMENT of the GODDESS LAKSHMI….. lol…. Do they even realize that they just VIOLATED the same MOTHER? They SLAPPED their OWN IDOL in her face and SPIT on her. SHAME ON YOU REALLY….. How do you even look at yourself in the mirror?
And I assure YOU all that those who committed the crime would have turned around and had bowed their heads again in front of the GODDESS WITHOUT AN OUNCE of REGRET or SHAME.
@Daljinder (23236)
• Bangalore, India
19 Feb 16
BUT that is not what we are talking about here. We are talking about how Democracy is still not understood completely and how that played into the JNU’s case among many others….
Quoting from wiki:
“WE, THE PEOPLE OF INDIA, having solemnly resolved to constitute India into a SOVEREIGN SOCIALIST SECULAR DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC and to secure to all its citizens:
JUSTICE, social, economic and political;
LIBERTY of thought, expression, belief, faith and worship;
EQUALITY of status and of opportunity; and to promote among them all FRATERNITY assuring the dignity of the individual and the unity and integrity of the Nation;
IN OUR CONSTITUENT ASSEMBLY this twenty-sixth day of November, 1949, do HEREBY ADOPT, ENACT AND GIVE TO OURSELVES THIS CONSTITUTION.”
Do take note of the words capitalized and emphasized. How many of our politicians or even normal citizens truly understand the meanings and importance of them? I mean take for example the word “SECULAR”. Such simple word that holds such a strong meaning behind it. BUT it is NOT understood correctly. If it were there wouldn’t be any “Babri Masjid” crisis in the first place.
Personally, I say demolish all the HOLY SHRINES of all RELIGIONS and call it a day. But I know that would be seen as me instigating a NUCLEAR EXPLOSION. I am not ANTI-religion. I am a believer too. BUT MY God is different from you all. I see My GOD in a child’s smile. I see My God when I do something good. I can go on and on and go all philosophical on you but I would stop right here.
Remember the saying from KABIR?
“Moko kahan dhoonde re bande, mien to tere paas mien”
Translation: Where do you search for me oh humble seeker, I am within you or very close to you.
“Naa mandir mien naa maszid mien, naa kaabe kailas mien”
Translation: I am neither to be found in a temple nor in a mosque, neither in Kaaba (the sacred place of Muslims) nor in Kailas (a sacred place of Hindus).
Well……..enough said, don’t you think?
http://santmatunderstanding.blogspot.in/2009/04/moko-kahan-dhoonde-why-do-you-search-me.html
From Wikisource Jump to: navigation, search Constitution of India (1949) the Government of India Preamble Part I.? The Constitution of India is the constitution of the Republic of India. It was adopted by the Constituent Assembly on November 26, 1949, an
2 people like this
@Daljinder (23236)
• Bangalore, India
19 Feb 16
@Daljinder Look at these view points of JNU students in the link below:
This page may be out of date. Save your draft before refreshing this page.Submit any pending changes before refreshing this page. Hide this message.QuoraSign In Anti-Indian Colleges and Universities in the NCT of Delhi Sentiments Jawaharlal Nehru Universi
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@Daljinder (23236)
• Bangalore, India
19 Feb 16
@Daljinder And here is another one:
This page may be out of date. Save your draft before refreshing this page.Submit any pending changes before refreshing this page. Hide this message.QuoraSign In Colleges and Universities in the NCT of Delhi Jawaharlal Nehru University Campus Row (February
2 people like this