Denomination vs. Religion
By Leca
@lecanis (16647)
Murfreesboro, Tennessee
March 22, 2007 9:00pm CST
I have noticed that the words "denomination" and "religion" are often confused when discussing religion, here on mylot and in other places.
A denomination, in terms of religion would be: a religious group, usually including many local churches, often larger than a sect: the Lutheran denomination.
A religion: a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.
So, a religion would consist of many denominations. However, if I start a discussion about "people of other religions" I without fail get many people answering as if other denominations in their religion were entirely different religions. Many of these people are surprised to find that I actually do belong to a different religion than they do, and not merely a different denomination.
Not only that, this also happens to me offline. If I say "Oh we don't have the same religion" to someone, trying to be polite but not offensive, they immediately assume I belong to another denomination of their religion. They invariably answer something along the lines of "But we both worship the same God", when in truth I do not worship the same God as people of their religion, or most other religions for that matter.
Does anyone else have thoughts on this issue?
3 people like this
6 responses
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
24 Mar 07
Yes, I understand that I am a Methodist, which is a denomination of the Prostestant religion, which is basically a break off from Catholism. I, however, have a difficult time fitting my beliefs into the same mold as Baptists, Pentacostals and other fundamentalist groups, so I prefer to make Methodism a religion all it's own. LOL
1 person likes this
@lecanis (16647)
• Murfreesboro, Tennessee
25 Mar 07
You know this led me to a thought, the difference between "personal definitions" and "dictionary definitions". I know there are many words for which I have my own definitions, or definitions that are used among my friend group or in my own relationship.
I think it's perfectly okay to have these personal definitions, but sometimes it makes discussion with those outside the group who understand them difficult. Hence the need for the standard definitions of terms.
Anyway, I can see how sometimes it is necessary to distance oneself from those within your larger "religion" that have beliefs that are objectionable, and I can see from what I've read of your other discussions why you would wish to do so. I can't blame you on that one.
Personally, the larger group I am considered part of consists of many religions that in ancient times were actually completely separate, each with their own gods and customs. In modern times, they've all become lumped together under a particular label. If I don't use this label (Pagan) then no one ever understands what I am saying about my religious beliefs. But if I do, then I'm relating myself in the eyes of others to a lot of people whose beliefs really don't always match up with mine that closely. I take it as part of a tradeoff for being able to converse easily and understandably with others, and insert personal explanations when they are asked for or appropriate.
I must say, one of these days I'm going to have to do a really intense study on the differences between Christian denominations. As a child, I knew Baptists and Methodists who fueded bitterly, and where I live now it seems to be the Apostolic Lutherans who don't even really get along with other Lutherans. Hard to understand for an outsider. When I have time, I really have to look into this more carefully.
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
26 Mar 07
yes, transdisc, I am a United Methodist. My father actually attended Wesleyn College outside Roanoke VA when he when he decided to convert to Christianity from Judaism. Prior to that he was studying to be a rabbi.
Yes, Lacanis. Much as the various Pagan "religions" differ, so do the various Christian sects. I actually feel that my religion is quite opened in regard to most of hte subjects that I feel strongly about. Although a number of openly gay ministers have been defrocked, which pi$$es me off, the denomination itself is actually very inclusive.
1 person likes this
@sigma77 (5383)
• United States
23 Mar 07
You presented that well, but I am still confused. Give me God, but not religion. I am thankful and appreciate all that God has given me. But what I don't understand is why God would need to be worshipped? After all, God is everything already, so why does he/she need worship from people? To me, worship is a vanity of people, as so many loved to be worshipped by others. Sorry, I guess I got off track. Good post, though.
1 person likes this
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
27 Mar 07
transdisc,
I love what you wrote above about God. So much so that I must interject my own theories. I get so sick and tired of hearing people say that God is all knowing and infallible. I don't agree. I believe we were created in God's image, warts and all. Just by reading the bible I can see that He is not all that wonderful. He is vengeful. He is prideful. He is boastful. THe story of Job is an excellent example of such. In order to prove a point to his nemisis, God tortured a man who worshipped him. This is horrible. He put the tree of the knowledge of good and evil into the garden of eden and told these kids not to eat from it. Well, kids being kids....There are numerous other examples of God's pridefullness and hostility to anything that is not done his way. And then there is scriptural evidence that God grew up and softened.
I have always thought of God as a father. A typical father. In the time of Adam and Eve, he was a new father, and he didn't quite know how to handle it. He told his children what to do and he expected them to do it. When he turned his back, they had their hands in the cookie jar. Later, when man was a teenager, he tested God, as teens will do with their fathers. As in the tower of Babylon. God grounded them for 150 years. Now that we are adults, he as elected to leave us alone and allow us to make our own mistakes. He knows that he as raised us as best as he could. He wants us to come to him if we need him, but he really wants us to make our own decisions. As any father would.
Many Christians scoff at this. But I cannot read the Bible without seeing this very scenario. Of course, many Christians scoff at much of what I have to say. So I say, OK. And I read the words of my "Big Brother" who taught us to love one another; who got really angry with corruption; who strove to bring us to a higher enlightenment.
Anyway, this is my summary of God.
1 person likes this
@lecanis (16647)
• Murfreesboro, Tennessee
25 Mar 07
Thanks for clarifying that, Transdisc! And, yes, it's all a crock. =p
My personal opinion on the matter is that "worship" is a silly idea anyway. I might say "worship" when talking about religion or spirituality because it's the accepted term, but I honestly thing "love" would be a better and simpler one. I think any real spiritual path has to be based on a personal relationship with whatever deity or deities are involved (if any, otherwise the higher self or nature or whatever), and "worship" isn't really a very good word to describe that.
@Ravenladyj (22902)
• United States
27 Mar 07
"However, if I start a discussion about "people of other religions" I without fail get many people answering as if other denominations in their religion were entirely different religions"
Ya know I'll never be able to understand that....nor will I ever be able to grasp how it is that so many denominations (within Christianity for example) can be at battles with one another...for example..(hypothetically speaking) Roman Catholics feel that Presbiterians are wrong and arent truly Christian....I've been in forums where ppl have actually gone at a battle of the wits over which denom is "right" and neither of them were armed (so needless to say I was highly entertained by it all LOL)
I think that is actually one of the reasons ppl confuse the two...becuase there are denoms that feel other denoms are WRONG....silliness IMO
1 person likes this
@lecanis (16647)
• Murfreesboro, Tennessee
28 Mar 07
*nods* Yes, I find it kind of silly as well.
It's funny to me that I can practice with or have religious discussions with people who believe in totally different gods than mine, and still get along with them better than some people who worship the same god. *scratches her head*
@arseniajoaquin (1732)
• Philippines
28 Mar 07
Denomination is the group, religion is that which the group follows in life. For example, my group is the Church of Christ and my religion is the Christian religion. I follow the Christian religion laid down in the Holy Bible. If the Christian religion is there set up in the Holy Bible and a person does not follow it, naturally that person is not a Christian. That's just how simple it is, even if they worship the same God. Another example is the Catholic religion which follows the Catechism. The Catholics are not Christians because they are Catholics. A mango fruit is not the same as the avocado fruit although they are the same fruits. Simple.
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
29 Mar 07
lecanis,
A friend sent this to me this morning and I thought that it would fit this discussion very nicely.
Religious Light Bulb Jokes
1. How many charismatics does it take to change a light bulb?
Only one since his/her hands are in the air anyway.
2. How many Calvinists does it take to change a light bulb?
None. God has predestined when the lights will be on. Or... Calvinists do not change light bulbs. They simply read out the instructions and pray the light bulb will decide to change itself.
3. How many Baptists does it take to change a light bulb?
CHANGE???????
4. No. Really, how many Baptists does it take to change a light bulb?
At least 15. One to change the light bulb, and three committees to approve the change and decide who brings the potato salad.
5. How many neo-evangelicals does it take to change a light bulb?
No one knows. They can't tell the difference between light and darkness.
6. How many Church of Christ does it take to change a light bulb?
Six men. One to authorize the change; two to look up the scriptures to see if it's something Jesus or Paul would approve of; and three to keep the women in submission, i.e. keeping them from giving advice, instructions, or usurping authority over the men.
7. How many Pentecostals does it take to change a light bulb?
Ten. One to change the bulb and nine to pray against the spirit of darkness.
8. How many Tele-evangelists does it take to change a light bulb?
One. but for the message of light to continue, send in your donation today.
9. How many fundamentalists or independent Baptists does it take to change a light bulb?
Only one because anymore would be compromise and ecumenical standards of light would slip.
10. How many Methodists does it take to change a light Bulb?
At least ten, as they need to hold a debate on whether or not the light bulb exists. Even if they can agree upon the existence of the light bulb they still may not change it to keep from alienating those who might use other forms of light.
11. How many Anglicans or Catholics does it take to change a light bulb?
None. They always use candles.
@simplysue (631)
• United States
23 Mar 07
I actually never thought about this until reading your post. You're right as far as what people assume. Religion in not a topic I touch very often because while I do believe there is a Higher Power, there are too many different rules among too many denominations within one religion to make any kind of sense in my head. It would seem that all humans think their way of worshiping is the only way, the only correct way...........it causes trouble between people........I don't think my Higher Power appreciates being used as an excuse for people to fight and judge each other. I hope no one takes offense to this post because there was no offense intended. :)
1 person likes this
@simplysue (631)
• United States
23 Mar 07
Thank you Transdisc. :) It's hard to discuss some topics online as no one can see your facial expressions of hear your tone as you speak. And you are right.....not all humans. I shouldn't speak of such a vast group as a whole.
1 person likes this
@lecanis (16647)
• Murfreesboro, Tennessee
23 Mar 07
Thanks for your response! I agree with you, the different rules among the denominations of the same religion can be dizzying. I often have this problem as a non-Christian in a largely Christian area: people are always talking about which church people belong to, and I often have to ask a lot of questions to understand the differences.
"I don't think my Higher Power appreciates being used as an excuse for people to fight and judge each other."
This is a very insightful statement.
I'm with Transdisc in that I don't believe all people feel that way. I certainly don't feel that way myself. I think everyone is free to their own beliefs, and I don't think that my way is even necessarily right for everyone. It's just right for me. =)
