How many is enough?

we have so many in this country that will sit at home and have so many kids and then live off government welfare. Spanish families in my neighborhood are known for it. Not that I think all Hispanics are like this, because they're not...but there are some that are abusing the programs.

I'm fully aware of this...but if you read what I wrote, I said ALL are not like this. I was referring to the family down the road from me. It's not a race thing. And from the looks of these posts...it's not even a US thing..but a global issue.

Uggh-do we have to bring race into it? Plenty of white families do the same thing. Being a lazy mooch doesn't have anything to do with race or country of origen.

you hit the nail right on the head. It's personal choice, and the parents themselves that makes or breaks a family. I know single child households where the kids are virtually ignored, and kids with multiple siblings whose parents go out of their way to make each feel special.

Well I am happy that you are happy. And please note I did not make an assumption that the couple in this topic could not afford to keep their own children - my comments were just general ones on the subject of big families and ones that have been mentioned here many times in earlier posts, especially from other UK and European posters. Certainly here in England, this couple would automatically receive the grand total of £140.00 a week (that's about $280 a week) just for having 11 children, - and that to me is WRONG. Some people in low paid jobs don't earn that in a week, and yet still have to pay taxes for other peoples' kids. This couple may have enough money, but in many parts of Europe that would not stop them claiming this benefit, and if they are "missionaries" I doubt they have much money, as surely all their money should be channelled back to the Church? I'm very tempted to wonder why a forward-thinking, developed, and mannily Christian country like Germany needs "missionaries" to be sent there anyway - but that's another topic!

I live in the US, so I can't address your claims about Family Allowances in the UK. Children are the future of our society, though, and it makes sense to me that society would invest in its own future. I will comment, though, on your assertion that it's not possible to give a large family all the time, effort and support that they need. I "only" have 6, but I haven't found it at all difficult to know my children as individuals. I know their temperaments, their interests, their friends, their strengths and weaknesses. Although I feel my family is now complete, I could do the same for another half dozen if need be. Kids do need an individual relationship with parents, but they don't necessarily need the parents' undivided attention 24/7. "Quality time" also doesn't have to mean sitting on the floor playing cars. My children play with each other. I watch and referee as needed. I spend time with them in the kitchen (kids love to cook), in the car (getting to go alone to the store with mom is a treat), playing board games. My kids have learned by living in a big family that other people exist around them and have needs, that they can contribute in really meaningful ways to the family. They always have someone to play with or talk to. They have learned to look out for the little guy and that little kids may be looking up to them. They have learned to distinguish between need and want, and to be content rather than hanging their happiness on the next new toy. One final comment-nothing in the OP would lead me to believe that this family can't afford to care for this new child. That assumption is faulty.

I'm not familiar with Family Allowance. I'm aware that I do get fairly significant tax breaks in the US for having children. The comment about being able to afford them is one that comes up in most discussions about large families. It's rude and condescending.

My oldest two graduated from private school. My youngest is a Senior there this year. We could not have given our kids that luxury if we'd had more than 3. It was a tight squeeze some years anyway, but the public schools are so bad here...there wasn't much of an option.

I guess this is true! What makes me sick...is this girl is the size of a pencil when she's not pregnant and eats more than I do. I told her one time...that if I ate like she did, and had the amount of kids that she's been able to carry full term...that I'd weigh 400 pounds. She just laughed.

Boys? Girls? I only have 3. We wanted more, but I had trouble with the last pregnancy and the doctor didn't recommend it.

I have 4 boys and my only daughter that tells the whole house what to do. lol They make our life a lot of fun.

how funny. I am the oldest...and the only girl. I bet your daughter and i would get along great!

I would have loved to have had one more. God didn't see it that way. I had some pretty major health issues with the youngest one, and she was born almost 2 months early. I was afraid that if I tried to have a 4th, even waiting a few years like we planned, that the baby wouldn't be healthy.

When the first of their kids were little and ours were about the same age, we always sent them Christmas gifts...one for each child. Now, we simply purchase something the whole family can enjoy, because it's hard to buy for them all. That's my biggest drawback.

that is a great idea. We started drawing names several years ago, and it works so great. We draw on Christmas day after all the gifts are opened, so we have the whole year to shop for that person. Most of us get great gifts, sometimes including several items that fit our personalities.

I'm sure they appreciate a group gift. I have a large family, while my brother and sister have 3 and 2, respectively. A few years ago we changed the way we do Christmas gifts, mostly b/c I have so many. The adults play Dirty Santa, with a $5 gift. Each family of cousins gets a gifts for each other family of cousins. It is usually a game or video or something similar. I prefer it this way, b/c I like my kids having some things to share. Santa brings them individual gifts.

I was afraid to ask how much it was! I know a couple of the smaller ones were able to sit on laps of the older ones. I don't think they can do that now. Andy's Dad travels quite a bit, and I think they get his frequent flyer miles.

Wow, I can't imagine how much their airline expense was. It might be cheaper for them to buy a small plane with all those children! LOL I'm glad they are able to have a big family like that and still take care of everything.

I think the lady with 20 kids uses her kids to do most of the work. I can't condone that. I think kids need to have chores, and need to work around the house to help, but I don't think they should be forced to do it all. My friends with large families have 2 parents who help with the house, the kids etc... I don't know how they would do it otherwise.

I simply think it depends on the parents, and the attitude in which they raise their children. I am one of 4. I was the oldest, and I babysat my younger brothers alot. Even after I got married. I don't resent them or my parents for that. There is a love and a bond there that we might not have had otherwise. I'm sorry that your wife was abused, because that is just not right in any way, culture, religion, family size or anything else. I know only children who are abused. Don't lump all big families in with one or two bad experieces. There are alot of big families out there who are happy and have healthy relationships. And small families out there...who aren't.

yes, this is the point..older brothers and sister made to babysit often resent their younger brothers and sisters..my wife was abused by her older sister..and i had a an older brother who was always picking on me and watching me worse then a parent..and he did not do things in a good way..i still hate him to this day for the abuse and so does my wife..she can't stand her older sister...this is the point..why have children to raise them in this fashion..but do what you want..the shrinks get rich off of the victims of victims...we are all victims

I will bet that you had a ball growing up. I've always wondered, being the oldest of 4...what it would have been like being the baby of the family. Can you fill me in ? ;)

I agree. But I've been floored at the amount of people who have thought it was a money thing. You know...I never even considered the financial end of it. Maybe because I know the couple, and know they are going to take care of the financial end of it without blinking twice. All of their kids have college funds.

Being the baby def. had it's ups and downs growning up. However it isn't all that great.

Where are you that you get child benefits? Here in USA, not everyone gets child benefits. This particular family, the mother is a nurse, and they make anough money to support their own children without help from the government. I'd hate to think of someone just having kids to live off the government.

Personally, I think the Duggar's are crazy...but I agree with you. I would have pulled my hair out by now. What makes me so frustrated is that I struggle with my weight and here she is skinny as soon as she delivers. Where is the fairness in all of that? hahahaa

I'm the same way with my 3. No c-sections, but I didn't carry either of the girls anywhere close to term, and they were very sick little ones. It just wasn't safe for me to have any more, for me or the babies.

There are times when I had trouble juggling three. Now, two are grown, the other a Senior in High School. I wonder where my babies went. Some of my friends are just now starting their families, and I find that I'm a bit jealous of them having tiny ones again.

I guess it's just what each of us decides is best for us as individuals. I know there are families out there who would give anything to have a child though.

Don't think they eat out much! The oldest two are in college, and another will be a Senior this year, just as mine are. The only difference is, next year, I will be all alone..just hubby and the dogs, and she will have a little one who still needs her.

I was right the opposite. I LOVED being pregnant. There are such great memories: the feel of the baby moving the first time, her little hand showing up on the side of my stomach, a kick that made you pee down your leg at odd times. Ok...maybe that part wasn't so great. but hey!

My mother in law is one of 12, that spanned 24 years! Can you imagine being pregnant every other year for a quarter of decade? That's just crazy to me.