Is the Christian God barbaric?
By Jimeous
@Jimeous (858)
New Zealand
June 2, 2009 10:54am CST
I have often thought of this...
Here we have a god which....
Killed children and babies, killed old people, killed the poor and rich, killed the sick and the well, killed the invalided, well you name it, he wiped out all but a handful of people in the world...
Is the flood an act of barbarism?
1 person likes this
10 responses
@Frederick42 (2024)
• Canada
3 Jun 09
In this discussion, we are dealing with the Biblical god. Yes, you are totally right that this God is barbaric. Not only is he barbaric, but he is insane. When insanity and barbarism mix, we can see the results. Such is the god of the Bible.
But we have to understand that this god never existed. He is an imaginary god. To say that the jews were the first worshippers of the true God is a big joke and one who says that has not made any study of ancient pagan mythology. There are many similarities between the Bible and ancient pagan myths and since the pagan myth existed before Judaism, it is quite clear that the Bible is plagiarised. The jews copied from the myths and twisted according to thier convenience and succeded in creating a God whom they considered as the only true God.
Yes, this god is barbaric. He is a despicable creature. To say that he is compassionate only shows how deluded the people of this planet are. Jesus's sacrificing himself on the cross does not impress me. I do not think his crucifixion will compensate the deaths of the millions of people whom god killed in the old testament.
To say that 'God knows best', 'We are not to question his wisdom' , 'his wisdom is far greater than ours' - all such statements are made by those who do not want to think. Such people are deluded and are themselves barbaric. Such people do not want to discuss seriously. Maybe they are afraid that a serious discussion will result in the collapse of their beliefs. This type of people will go on worshipping a despicable creature only because they are afraid to question barbarism.
To say not to question the wisdom of the Biblical God is as good as saying not to question the wisdom of Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin etc.. This type of thinking is not at all healthy if our world has to progress and become evolved.
3 people like this
@bestboy19 (5478)
• United States
5 Jun 09
"But we have to understand that this god never existed." If the God of the Bible never existed, why are you getting so bent out of shape, and how can you say He's barbaric if He's not real? If you didn't read over your statement before you posted it, maybe you should start doing that.
@Frederick42 (2024)
• Canada
5 Jun 09
What gives you the idea that I am bent out of shape? The fact is that I am very cool and calm over here. But millions of people all over the world really believe that this god existed and they worship him. That is the reason we are discussing about the character. If people all over realised that this god never existed, then there would have been no reason to discuss about him.
In a movie, we see many characters- some good, some not so good and some barbaric. A character may be mythological or real, but just because a barbaric mythical character is mythical does not mean we should not refer to him as barbaric.
But the sad thing is that christians do not recognise this barbaric character as mythical. They consider him as the true God- not only that, but the only true God.
Just imagine how it would be if people started worshipping Hitler? And do not think it impossible to justify Hitler's actions. Just say 'Who are we to question Hitler's wisdom?' and thus the matter is settled.
3 people like this
@freethinkingagent (2501)
•
4 Jun 09
Why do you say Christian God? The Christians are not the one who wrote this story? And besides you left out the reason WHY the flood happened. God did NOT cause the flood, He only warned it was coming. I have no Idea why people love to keep rewriting the bible. This story is 4000 years OLDER than the old testament originally told by the Sumerians. So again, God did not make the flood are send a flood,he only warned man (depending on which version) or a Man to spare his family because "He was perfect in his generations".
The whole reason for God allowing the flood to devastate man is clearly set forth in both the Bible, and the Epic of Gilgamesh as in other ancient text.
2 people like this
@Netsbridge (3253)
• United States
2 Jun 09
The God of creation is a God of love and order, and a good God! While he makes the sun to shine on everyone and the rain to fall upon everyone, there are just some things in the Bible and other Holy texts that I believe we will never understand here on earth. I am Christian. While I believe that the words in the Bible are inspired, some of them, I believe, are simply man's inspiration; not direct words from the God of creation.
I have also come to believe that when you read about God in the Bible or other Holy texts such as the Torah and the Kuran, it does not necessarily refer to the God of creation, who throughout the Bible shows nothing but love and patience towards His creatures. Yes, there are other gods refered to in the Bible! While the Bible talks about the God of creation, it also talks about other gods - such as the god of Israel, whom you see as being impatient and very vengeful!
Since I discovered this implications, I am often careful about making reference to the God of this or that person, especially when praying! I believe that just like anyne can make any idol to be god, people can make even the God of creation to be anything they wish!
@Adoniah (7513)
• United States
3 Jun 09
The Israelis were the first Monotheists. They were the first people to believe in The Creator. Prior to that all there were were pagans and nonbelievers. The True Creator led the Israelis and warned them of coming false gods and false messiahs. Then came the false religion with their false messiah and their 3 gods and their virgin queen. They pray to saints and angels instead of the True Creator. They pray to a virgin queen and a false messiah. They have brought back polytheism.
Only Jews and Muslims follow Monotheism and the True Creator. All others follow polytheism.
@Netsbridge (3253)
• United States
12 Jun 09
"Only Jews and Muslims follow Monotheism and the True Creator. All others follow polytheism."
Adoniah, I think that you mistakenly put the words monotheism and polytheism in the inappropriate places in the above sentence. I ma sure you must be aware that all the major Abrahamic religions (those being Judaism, Christianity and Islam) all share the accounts of Christianity's Old Testament. And, as you must have noticed, the Israelites of the Bible were anything but monotheistic. I have even come to believe that most of the record in the Bible about the Israelites are words geared towards achieving a form of social justice.
1 person likes this
@Chiang_Mai_boy (3882)
• Thailand
3 Jun 09
Ancient words from ancient times. In barbaric times it is no suprise that the myths that arose in those times would feature a barbaric superhero.
The god you are speaking of is the god of the tribes of Israel, not the Christian god. The idea of the Christin god evolved from this older version of god but the Christian god is sort of God 2.0, a sanitized god striped of its barbaric roots and cleaned up for modern consumption.
Since the flood is an old Mesopotamian myth it is not an act of barbarism, only an old fable.
@freethinkingagent (2501)
•
4 Jun 09
yes the flood story of the Sumerians is 4000 years older than the retelling in the bible.
2 people like this
@YazEid (1139)
• Philippines
2 Jun 09
God was never barbaric , he created all those and he is not waiting from then money nor food , he just created them to worship him ..
And he didn't kill who you are talking about .. he just founded roles in this life , if you get sick and you didn't seek medication you might die , no one is immortal , and if someone killed another he will die .. these are roles of life , so if you went and killed someone you can't just say that God killed him because you did not God
1 person likes this
@Jimeous (858)
• New Zealand
3 Jun 09
Thanks for the comments.
Since money is a man-made tool of exchange, it wouldn't be likely that God would have had that motivation. And since food is needed to maintain the physical body, again it is unlikely to be a motivating point. Those are desires of the flesh and it would be foolhardy to associate them with God
The word kill is applicable because He bought an "end" to the life of his creation in a direct manner.
@Vaddiba (190)
•
3 Jun 09
The "god" of the Old Testament is the very same "god" of the New Testament; the very same Christian "god".
Barbarism is an understatement when you read about the genocide that the biblical "god" (Christian "god") supported and encouraged.
Christians continue to lie about the character of their "god" because they are embarrassed by "his" recorded acts of wickedness.
How can a "god" be loving if "he" leads and supports genocide? Hypocrites and liars that's what I say.
The Christian "god" is more than barbaric. Read the Old Testament. Isn't the Old Testament "god" the same "god" that created Israel? Of course, it is. It's the same "god" being described in a more digestible and acceptable form in the New Testament. But, it's the same "god". Christians need to STOP LYING about that fact.
1 person likes this
@freethinkingagent (2501)
•
4 Jun 09
How can you blame God for the words and actions of man?
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@Vaddiba (190)
•
3 Jun 09
My own position is that the bible is written by man who created the concept of a "god".
However, my response to the question of the Christian "god" being barbaric, is based on the Christian assumption that THEIR "GOD" is real. So, ...
... if their "god" in the Old Testament created the universe, ...
... if their "god" brought the flood ...
... if their "god" once led the nation of Israel ...
Then it's the very same "god" that Jesus talks about in the New Testament.
Therefore, the Old Testament "god" is the very same New Testament "god". Pretty simple logic, really.
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@Gangabag (28)
• Netherlands
3 Jun 09
It all depends on what you consider the God of the Christians to be. I would argue that the Christian God is the God of Christ, who I wouldn't consider to be barbaric (turn the other cheek, give the second coat). Bear in mind that the barbarism of the old testament cannot be taken as a reflection of God, but rather a reflection of how man (in this case the ancient Israelites) percieves God. As pointed out by Jethro Tull, in the beginning, man created God. And as man was rather barbaric, his God appeared to be so as well. It's man that is barbaric, not God.
1 person likes this
@Latrivia (2878)
• United States
3 Jun 09
Well, the flood never really happened, so I can't say it was barbaric. I don't believe in gods, and therefore see the god of the Jews (as this is the god you're describing), as a figment of imagination. Theoretically, though, if we pretend the god exists, and the atrocities did happen, then yes, it would've been barbaric.
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@SusanLee (1920)
• United States
13 Jun 09
No, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is not barbaric.
Your wisdom only goes as far as your knowledge. Read the whole book and only the book and don't mix every Tom, Di-k and Harry author out there whose warped opinion is now in paper back.
You can't get two people in a room to agree on anything, how can you expect to get a multitude of people to agree on anything?
Read it yourself, all of it and try to do it with a receptive heart, there is more to it then just the printed words on the pages.
Geez, so many people approach the bible like a box of candy, they look at the box and never really open it up to see what's inside.
You can't just flip open a few pages and get the truth that's inside. You have to dig around in there.
And there is no wrong in coming out and saying what you said here; to Him. He's not going to knock you down with a bolt of lightening. He knows your opinion of Him and He knows why you have that opinion. If you want to know the real truth, the whys and what-fores, then for crying out loud, ask Him.
1 person likes this
@Mikaela_taz25 (1842)
• Philippines
3 Jun 09
I have to disagree about GOD being Barbaric, please don't take it out on him. it's the worshipers and the priest some wrong doings that caused to give Christianity a Bad Name, but is not to blame for this atrocity. there some worshipers in their religions act to naive and selfish that they discriminate others.that's sad but true in most cases. .
@fheroan (615)
• Philippines
5 Jun 09
well, i see from the comments that its a litte bit offensive to our God and it happen I'm a christian..so i'll explain to you..you said barbaric, that term is not used properly, barbaric means something uncivilized...God in the Old testament in the Bible...(this was all done by Satan),wiped out the ppl at that time because of their evil doings, ppl and the fallen angels joined together that their fruits where giants and monsters, this creatures where not intended for the world, the earth was made by God for humans to rule not those creature..so lets say you created your human beings..and they do evil things, they dont obey you, they blaspheme you..do u think you'll just sit their at your throne in heaven and just ignore them?..that's a NO!..thats why God wiped them but still He has Noah so we're still here..God has another plan for humans..so i think you must be careful of your words..you dont know what is in God's heart..
and about the killing its still more on the OT side..at that time Satan knows that the Messiah will come so he caused nations to war with Israel and so...you can't just sit back there and get killed...so you must fight too...if they didn't protect themselves b4...Jesus can't be born and redeemed us...
so i think what we can only do is....just live our normal lives and let God do all the rest..because He foreknew all the things that happened and the things that will happen in this world..:D