Grammar: To Teach or Not to Teach?
By kevchua
@kevchua (1004)
Malaysia
July 15, 2009 10:35pm CST
There are two schools of thoughts: Grammar is important part of a language, so it must be taught as a single subject; it's the fundamentals. Grammar is not important, it should be taught in context, not as a subject on its own in class.
Which school do you belong to? As far as I'm concerned, I'd go for the first one simply because if students don't know the rules, how could they be proficient enough in all the four language skills (Grammar, Reading, Writing, Listening & Speaking)?
Could I have your two cents' worth, please?
1 person likes this
12 responses
@thea09 (18305)
• Greece
16 Jul 09
Hi kevchua, at my son's school huge emphasis is placed on the teaching of grammar but it is not taught as a separate subject to the teaching of the language itself. Greek lessons include all aspects of the language but at the end of term handwriting and spelling have a separate grade. The rules of grammar are continualy reinforced in the first years of schooling which is necessary as the subject of Greek grammar is extremely complex.
@LingoWang (156)
• China
22 Jul 09
I have been read many english grammar books written by expert from china and abroad. But when i read the works by john updike. I can not undterstand the sentence structure.
It is really a big challege!
@LingoWang (156)
• China
22 Jul 09
The book i read is john updike's of the farm.
I can really learn a lot from it, words, expressions and sentence structures.
That's really important to me!
But i think his languages are begond most of the grammar experts' works.
@kevchua (1004)
• Malaysia
22 Jul 09
I'm unable to comment on the grammar books that you're using because I don't know the contents of the books. Some authors write in an easier way to understand compared to others, and bear in mind that not all experts are able to write grammar books for students who are not-so-good in grammar. Go to the bookstore and find one that really suits you :)
John Updike's "A & P" is quite alright (if you've read that), so is Steinbeck's "The Chrysanthemums". The problem lies in extracting the underlying, or hidden messages that the authors are conveying to the readers, but if you read these texts, I think it's rather easy in terms of vocabulary and sentence structure.
It requires patience and time to be good in English and to understand heavy texts. What you probably need is more exposure to the language. There are many expatriates in China, even in schools, so you might want to say hi to them and be friends :) The more you use the language, the better it is.
1 person likes this
@macdingolinger (10386)
• United States
16 Jul 09
Perhaps I could add another "school of thought" to your list. It would be that grammar is indeed very important and may still be taught in context. When I taught English, I taught some grammar separately, and some in context. Only after teaching a topic alone did begin to count off for it in the student's written texts. I suppose I am saying that there is a healthy combination of the two schools of thought!
@kevchua (1004)
• Malaysia
16 Jul 09
Thanks for your thoughts. Indeed, there's a third school of thought - the eclectic method. As you've mentioned, it combines both teaching Grammar separately and in context. However, in schools where I've taught, English is allocated only 3-6 hours weekly in the timetable, students struggle to string a grammatically correct sentence, and grammar items are tested in exams. Would this eclectic method still work? Time is a factor. Over here, if students fail the exam, the education authorities would point their fingers at the teachers. The education system in my country is very exam-oriented, by the way :)
What's your comment on this?
@macdingolinger (10386)
• United States
16 Jul 09
They are very exam oriented over here too! Fingers point at teachers here as well when students do not do well on the tests. I actually think it would still work even in a limited time frame. Actually, it might work better for some. Perhaps it would be possible to cover more material in a short time. For instance, a student could be given several things to look for in a paragraph, then asked to write their own on a given topic given using the same techniques they looked for in the other writing... I'm not sure I said that properly!!
@Sandra1952 (6047)
• Spain
21 Jul 09
When I was in junior school in the late 1950's, we had a short session each day of either grammar, spelling, tables, mental arithmetic or handwriting. Over the school week, we spent about half an hour each day polishing our skills in these areas, and then we put them into practice in our main lessons. We were tested regularly on what we had learned, and if it was obvious from our test results that we hadn't understood something, our teacher would go over it again until we - and she - were happy. By using this 'bite size' technique, we were absorbing what we needed almost without realising it.
50 years on, my spelling, grammar, handwriting and mental arithmetic is pretty well faultless. Some modern education professionals may say that such methods of learning have no place in schools today, but I would disagree. Unless children grasp the basics at an early stage, we will continue to produce school leavers who are almost illiterate and couldn't string a sentence together with 50 yards of rope. In answer to your question, I'd say grammar should be taught as a mixture of single subject exercises and in context practical assignments. Thanks for making us think about this.
@kevchua (1004)
• Malaysia
22 Jul 09
I like the "bite size" technique that you've mentioned, but then, it was a long time ago. I'm not sure if it is still practical to use in an exam-oriented environment where teachers pit themselves against time to finish the syllabus so that students are able to answer exam questions for the English paper. If not for the focus on exams, I'd have tried the bite-sized method as mentioned (never done it before). I don't consider this technique old or useless now, it's just not practical - I think that's what the professionals meant when they said it has no place in schools today.
I've been teaching various levels from elementary to high school students for about two decades, yet have not discovered a way to really help students improve grammar in a short time. In tertiary institutions (like where I'm teaching now) - it's all "touch & go" - you teach, you explain, you prepare them for exams, then you're done... to a group of 40-60 students, and in less than a year.
No wonder they're still weak, and they still make the same mistakes!! Education policy :(
@jb78000 (15139)
•
16 Jul 09
i teach english as a second language so i'll annoy you by commenting here. in your comment it looks almost perfect (you've missed out the 'in' before between and 'thing' after important but native speakers do that sort of thing all the time). i wouldn't be able to tell you weren't a native speaker except, maybe, for the lack of contractions. anyway you're right the most important thing is communicating, everything doesn't need to be absolutely perfect.
@Swashbuckle (305)
• United States
17 Jul 09
The thing here is that people do not speak as they write.
If you heard me speaking, I doubt you'd get half the things I say. Which is why I write more than I speak to people anyway.
@just_mavis (19)
•
16 Jul 09
I think it should be taught in schools, along with spelling. Clear use of language helps you communicate correctly, and on a practical level helps you in the job market. I have seen plenty of CVs which were filled with spelling mistakles, and it gives a really bad impression of the candidate
@angelparis (58)
• India
16 Jul 09
well i thnk grammer is very important and it shud b tough as a single subject not as a part of english...........the spelling the pronouncation in a correct way r of great importance noe a days
@di1159 (1580)
• United States
16 Jul 09
I belong to the Old School! Many students don't know grammatical rules. They cannot tell you where to use commas, semi-colons, and other punctuation marks. They are unable to decipher a sentence and tell you what an adverb, adjective, or subject is. Without proper grammar the art of writing suffers as well.
@Swashbuckle (305)
• United States
17 Jul 09
I stear away from anyone with a freaking run on sentence!
I had to decode and label which word was what, and if you can't figure out what a freaking verb is, than don't bother writing a book. That's my view on it.
Now, if you can write in a way that I can understand as a reader, that's a totally different story.
@charlies2805 (777)
•
19 Sep 09
I prefer the first one. Grammar is very important and it bascily the base of conversation, writings, and evrything. It should be studied proper way. But I easily find people neglect grammar rules when they make conversation. =) It's okay as long as they understand each other and do not change the meaning of it.
@jshekhar (1562)
• India
16 Jul 09
Hello friend,
I learned all my English through reading newspapers and magazines and listening to cricket commentary while watching the game. I have never been taught the fundamentals but still, I consider my grammar is fine enough.
however, I do feel that I sometimes get stuck with the tenses. Still, I would recommend that if you have to teach the language to a young kid, you can start off by exposing him to the newspapers and child magazines and then slowly include a chapter of grammar and parts of speech here and there.
I know it sounds tough but then, that's what I have to contribute..
Cheers!
@Swashbuckle (305)
• United States
17 Jul 09
Reading this message I would never have thought that you didn't know English.
Of course, the teaching methods vary, you can't just make a kid learn. *lol*
But I am glad to see that you taught yourself, that is something to be admired.
I don't pay attention to my tenses, whatever feels right in my head is usually what I type. It may look weird later, but I really don't care.
@Swashbuckle (305)
• United States
17 Jul 09
I grew up with 'English' which is basically grammar/spelling/other writing being taught as I whole. I learned how to look words up in a dictionary, how to write letters to a business and where to put an apostraphe, though I must admit that part is still a bit weird for me.
I shall say that I don't care how it is taught as long as it is. If people don't understand Grammar than they shouldn't write, because I really think that if someone is going to write, than they must understand the fundamentals. Sure, it is fine to break a few rules, but you should be careful about which rules you break.
@tomjoad (551)
• Philippines
16 Jul 09
hi there! i hope you don't mind if i share my opinion even though i am not an english teacher. i have always loved english and the subject has always fascinated me. you see, english is not our mother tongue. however, our medium of instruction at school is english.
anyway, i agree with what macdingolinger said. when i was still studying, english grammar, reading, and writing and all the forms of speech was taught in just one subject. obviously, the subject was called English. i don't believe that grammar is not important. in fact, i believe that proper grammar should be taught early. grammar is an essential part of language. it makes communication easier and more effective.
furthermore, i don't think it's very difficult to integrate grammar while teaching speech, reading, writing, etc. in fact you can't separate grammar because it's basic. my teachers in past did that and it was very effective. there's no reason why it can't be done now. in fact it would be great if we integrate grammar, speech, reading, writing, listening and speaking in just 1 curriculum and still have a separate grammar class. that would actually be better. do you agree?