They won't baptize my child!!!
By candygurl24
@candygurl24 (1880)
Canada
January 25, 2007 3:41pm CST
Ok, if you are used to my other discussions, you will remember that I myself am not religious, and may question why I even care that they won't baptize my child.
My oldest daughter is indeed baptized to be Catholic, as I was, and I would like my youngest to be as well.
When I took my last trip home to Nova Scotia, I visited the priest at my "old church" and told him that I would like to have my daughter baptized in that church as well. He told me no, flat out because I did not attend church on a regular basis. Note that I did not attend church on any kind of level when I had my oldest daughter baptized.
I questioned his response, and told him that I wanted to give my child the choice later in life to attend church, and that having her baptized was just the first step.
He told me that as long as he had anything to do with that church, that he would not do any baptisms on my child and that if something happened to her that she would die without a name. Welllllll wellllllll.
I stood up trying to hold in all of the horrible things that I wanted to say to him at that point and told him that as long as he was at that church, it would suffer the loss of my family and their generous donations, and that if anything should happen to my child that she will die with the name that I myself gave her, and that I did not need to hear any more of his bull.
Since then, my grandmother, grandfather, and other family members refuse to go to that church. In fact, they are all being re baptized in the anglican church, their beliefs are similar to the catholic religion, and they don't make insane rules to scare you. They are also willing to give my child the chance to have a religion to go to if that be her choice.
So now, first, sorry for writing a mini novel here, and second, do you think that it was right of the priest to deny my child a religion because I do not attend that church on a regular basis? Do you think it is right that he thinks he has the power that only God himself should have? And isn't it stated that all are welcome in God's house?
13 people like this
49 responses
@arseniajoaquin (1732)
• Philippines
26 Jan 07
In so far as Christianity is concerned, there should only be one book as basis for what should be done and that is the Holy Bible. The Roman Catholic Church follows the Catechism laid down by the Roman Catholic Church heirarchy long before but they sometimes amend as they please. they have the sacraments one of which is baptism (of children).
In the Holy Bible, nothing could be found that a child has ever been baptized. Acts 2:38 says: Repent and be baptized... which means that the one to be baptized is learned and having learned, he repents of his former beliefs. Baptize came from the Greek word "baptizo" which means I immerse or dip (in water).
What the Roman Catholic Church do is to sprinkle water on someone who does now know what is happening like a child. This is not in accordance with the Holy Bible.
If you want to be subjected to God and not to the priests or heirarchy of the Roman Catholic Church, pls study and follow the Holy Bible.
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
26 Jan 07
My problem is not her posts as much as the presumption that her interpretation of scripture is the only valid interpretation. If we do not agree, we need to go to her profile and she will set us straight. Furthermore, it appears that she will not do anything that she can't find in scripture. The baptism of infants is, performed as a vow for the parents to bring the child up in a Christian household. Whether it's found in scripture or not, it's tradition. It's a bonding ceremony. Arsenia would have us believe that just because she can't find anything on the practice, it is something that should not be done. That is my problem.
1 person likes this
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
27 Jan 07
Acutally, I do agree. Baptising infants is not strictly a Catholic practice, but the idea that a child who is without sin would not see the kingdom of heaven rings untrue to me.
I am Methodist and we baptise infants, but it is symbolic. AS I've stated, it's a vow by the parents to raise the child in a Christian household. It has nothing to do with the sins of the child which are non existant. Even if you bring Original sin into the frey, Christ said, "Suffer the child to come unto me." Children are full of innocense and without sin.
1 person likes this
@Sissygrl (10912)
• Canada
25 Jan 07
I'm not religious myself, and i wont have this problem cause if she wants to be baptized or dunked in some water for whatever reasons, she will haev to do that one when she is old enough herself. I'll support whatever she wants to do but she can make the choice herself. whynot let your daughter do the same. since that priest is a jerk anyways, maybe all priests are jerks lol. i dunno i never met one LOL
3 people like this
@candygurl24 (1880)
• Canada
25 Jan 07
This indeed is a great idea. I will think it over and then see how everything goes. I know that I really had no interest in getting my oldest daughter baptized but it was the "right thing to do", and I was young and followed the family on what to do with my child. Thank frig I got my own mind..lol.
2 people like this
@budsr03 (2350)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
This baptism refusal has made me upset. It goes to show that this priest is not doing Gods work. He would probably refuse God himself from entering his own church. This is what to expect from the catholic church? then I definately don't want it. Take care Candygurl.
@babystar1 (4233)
• United States
25 Jan 07
I am a Catholic also, this is wrong, but the priests here do the same thing.If you do not go to that church they wont baptize your child, you have to go to the church that you belong to.This is really stupid I no.I know a lady that had the same trouble she was so mad about the church rules that she did not even baptize her baby yet.
3 people like this
@mobyfriend (1017)
• Netherlands
26 Jan 07
Frankly I don't understand the priest's argument that she would die name if she was not baptized. How dare he? God already knows the name of your daughter in fact He counts the hairs on everyone's head. She's just as much a child of God as the people going to that church. You are right it is bull to suggest that you are better off in the eyes of God when you are baptized. Jesus himself said: Let the children come to me and do not forbid them for such is the kingdom of God. (So maybe if your child chooses Jesus there is no church in the world that can do something about that. )
Raise your child with love and freedom of choice.
2 people like this
@mobyfriend (1017)
• Netherlands
26 Jan 07
Yes i understand you. I think if you want baptism for a child you should first study what baptism is. I think that priest only sees it as an initiaton ritual and nothing more. I come from a secular background and when i was baptized as an adult through full inmersion it was my personal choice.
On another note I don't like that in limbo notion very much because I have heard stories from catholics that their stillborn children were also in limbo because they were not named by baptism. I can't imagine how much emotional pain this notion has caused.
2 people like this
@michele609 (1687)
• United States
26 Jan 07
I cant believe that a priest would even deny you child like that and say such thing, that is crazy. You are right it is very wrong in my eyes also. That is GODS choice no his and he should have more respect for a person then that.
2 people like this
@babykay (2131)
• Ireland
26 Jan 07
I have heard of priests behaving like this the odd time in Ireland, refusing to baptize kids because their parents are not married. Although to be fair, I don't think it happens that often. I think the priests that discriminate like this are behaving in a very un-Christian manner. They are effectively excluding children because of their parents. In your case all you appear to have done to offend this priest is not attend mass regularly. It is no wonder that membership of the Catholic church in the west is going down. This priest is wrong in his actions. I would pay no attention to him whatsoever and continue with the Anglicans.
2 people like this
@abednego7 (1060)
• Philippines
26 Jan 07
Did you know that Jesus Christ was baptized when he was about 29 years old. Because baptism is a declaration of ones will to do his ministry on proclaiming God's will, it should be done when a person is ready to understand what baptism is all about and knows the responsibility attaching to it. That's why in our church, they don't baptize infants whom surely don't understand things like that. Baptism is not about giving a name, its about covenant between God and to one who will get baptize. Like you said you give your child a choice and that's actually God is doing giving us a choice if we will going to align ourselves into his law or not and He does not offer that when someone does not know what He is actually offering. You know Jesus Christ is the greatest man ever lived but it takes him about 29 years to become eligible for baptism.
2 people like this
@amafrias (455)
• United States
26 Jan 07
I had a somewhat similar situation in Mexico. My then fiancé and I were planning our weeding over there in his hometown. We went down to the local Catholic church to talk with the padre and see what we needed to do. Well, my husband had to learn all of these things in Spanish, I think they were the ten commandments, and something else. He also had to study for a test. Well, I was told I also would have to learn these things and pass the test in Spanish. I did not speak Spanish. I had to learn it all in like 5 days anyway to be married in "his" church. I also had to get ahold of my mother in the states and get her to track down my record of baptism, and confirmation. Being I was Methodist as a child and went to several different churches throughout my life this was going to be very difficult if not down right impossible. She cane up with some documents, and faxed them to me. I think she got them right off of print shop pro! So a lot of good the padre was doing requesting them, when they could be faked at the drop of a hat. I think he just did not want the "gringo" to marry the Mexican. Anyway, we married on time after much ado, and also had our daughter baptized after the ceremony. It was just as difficult explaining why there even was a child when we were not married in the church yet. The fact that we were civilly married made no difference to him.
I am glad you found a place to fulfill your wishes, and am equally glad you are giving your child the right and knowledge to choose his own way when old enough. Good luck..
@kareng (59137)
• United States
26 Jan 07
First of all I don't think the Priest has the right to make that decision. That should be rules of the church.
I really don't understand why Catholics baptize, since this is for faith, a newborn can't really make that decision.
I'm not of that faith, and always wanted my kids to make their own choice. They were brought up in the Baptist Church but went to Church often with my in laws who were Catholic. They decided they wanted to pursue the Baptist religion. It was their decision and I was determined to stand by whatever choice they made.
2 people like this
@judyt00 (3497)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
I think its a new change ofpolicy the Catholic church has started in order to weed out the people who just want their kids in catholic school. My grandkids can't be baptised in ANY church because theirparents don't go to church regularly, and my daughter can't get married in a church And I'm surprised the Anglican church is willingto do so if you don't. However, because their fathers are catholic, and have proof, the kids can still go to catholic school, which in our neighbourhood is a much better choice.
2 people like this
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
27 Jan 07
No, because the Roman Catholic church is a very political organization. Catholisism as a whole is not political. I dearly love the Eastern Orthydox, and they were the original. Perhaps if you want your child baptised catholic, you should seek out an eastern othydox affiliation.
1 person likes this
@candygurl24 (1880)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
See, this is what I really don't understand, "change of policy"..hmmm..shouldn't God be the only one to make the rules and regulations of the church? And as for wanting my child to go to a catholic school, I'd prefer her to be in a regular public school. I want my child baptized so that she has the choice to follow with it or not. As for the Anglican church, they are definitely fine with this. They don't have the bible stuck up their bums like the catholic churches seem to.
@bosing143c (564)
• Philippines
26 Jan 07
firstly, just register your child in your city/municipal/district registrar's office, for him/her to be recognized as legitimately born in that place by biological parents such as you;
and secondly, GET OUT OF THAT HYPOCRITICAL CHURCH! thank you
2 people like this
@candygurl24 (1880)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
He does indeed sound like one of those "holier than thou" catholics. I am ashamed to even mention that I was baptized RC and that I had my eldest daughter baptized there.
I really do try to see things from the Catholic point of view, but I can't seem to stick my head that far up my a*s. :)
@soldenski (2503)
• United States
26 Jan 07
I think that's a problem with most Catholic churches. They want you to be a member and attending mass and giving money in the envelope's they provide you that has a number that was assigned to you. I use to have my neighbor take my donation's so that I could baptize my daughter. My son, on the other hand, we had a priest come to our home and baptize him there. Although, we paid the priest, he did it when we wanted it done and how we wanted it done.
2 people like this
@thewatchlist (653)
• United States
26 Jan 07
It was his right to hold his ground. Baptism is a ritual to show your belief in God, not a Get Out of Hell Free card.
By performing baptismals for nonbelievers, what does that say to the people who hold some sort of value on this ritual?
Btw, I'm not religious... In my opinion, people should be allowed to pick if they want to follow a religious belief or not before they are forced to start taking part in ceremonies.
1 person likes this
@candygurl24 (1880)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
Hello. I do have a belief, it's just not exactly as the catholic religion portrays it. For my child it would not be a Get Out of Hell Free card or whatever nonsense you want to call it. Not having faith in the catholic teachings does not mean that I have no belief in a god..HUGE difference. And as for the priest, if I'm damned to hell, I'll see him right there and give him a good poke...see how he likes it.
@cyntrow (8523)
• United States
26 Jan 07
Sorry for that last post. I became suddenly irritated which is out of charactor for me.
I believe in the baptism of children. It is a bonding ceremony. It is a declaration of faith. You said you aren't religious, but that doesn't necessarily mean that you arent spiritual. If you aren't spiritual, the only reason to baptise would be tradition. If you are spiritual, I would suggest finding a non-denominational Christian minister to take care of matters for you. I do not condemn Catholics, I just sometimes feel that the "Church" is more interested in the holy dollars than in the spiritual growth of their parishoners. And this is not against individual priests, except the one you went to. LOL
2 people like this
@kiwimac (323)
• New Zealand
26 Jan 07
The question you ask is one of those vexed questions that different groups of Christians disagreed on 500 years ago and still disagree on now.
To begin with, I imagine the Catholic Priest was reluctant to baptise your child because you, being a non-church-goer, would not be able to bring her up in the 'nurture and admonition of the Lord.'
Having said that he was and is simply wrong to make the comments he did about your daughter.
The Anglican church does require that you give some thought to your child's spiritual nurture and any God-parents will be asked to commit to helping with that spiritual nurture as well. I am glad, however, that you & your extended family have found a home in the Anglican Church.
As for the question of paedo-baptism (the baptism of children) it is important to note that any number of times in the New Testament it says that someone was baptised "and their whole household with them." This, in New Testament times, would have included wife, children, slaves and their children, some of whom would have been children.
For the Anglican Church baptism is a promise of the Presence of God even in the lives of the smallest and least powerful. Jesus said, "let the little children come to me."
I wish you and your daughter well in your journey.
Ray McIntyre
Priest
Anglican Church International
@candygurl24 (1880)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
I think what Heaven was asking was pertaining to my comment on what the priest said to me about my daughter not having a name if she is not baptized and something happens to her. She is asking if the Anglican church believes the same...which is actually a great question. Thanks to both of you. :)
1 person likes this
@HeavenUnaware (1757)
• United States
26 Jan 07
Hello
Can I respectfully ask you, in the Angelican Church.. if you do not baptize the babies - what do you believe happens to them if they pass on? I understand the promise of bringing them up with the Presence of God in their lives - but isn't that more of a promise being made by the parents and not the child since it is too young to understand?
Just curious and thank you!
1 person likes this
@CatEyes (2448)
• United States
26 Jan 07
Being a catholic like I am, I have never heard of this before. I do know that you can babtize your own child; all you have to do is bless the water your self by saying the "I bless this water in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, Amen", then once the water is blessed you may babtize your daughter in the same manner "I babtize you in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Amen" You have just babtized your daughter and the church should recongnize it in the future. I would look in to your diocese and see what is going on witht that priest. I was not allowed to go to a methodist church nor a Babitst Church becasue I was Catholic, and I have been told my them that I will go to hell. So it's not just the Catholic church; it's the humans that are involved. Any time you have humans involved you will have imperfection and screw ups. I am sorry for what happened.
1 person likes this
@chuckt9881 (469)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
Of course the priest had the right to refuse to baptize your child! And it was the right choice too!
You have admitted that you are not a church-goer, so it seems unlikely that you will raise your child and guide her in her growth as a Roman Catholic.
Being baptized doesn't 'give' your a religion ... it is more an affirmation by the parents and godparents that this child will be raised to the point where she will choose for herself to become RC (at her Confirmation). You obviously won't be doing this, so there is no point in performing the baptism.
I too am from Nova Scotia, and a Roman Catholic. However, I attend a Baptist church with my wife. Our first child was introduced to the congregation when he was a year old -- no baptism for baptists until they can make the choice theirself. Our daughter will be a year old in July, and she will have her dedication at that time.
All I can say about the priest in question is that he may have been a little blunt in his response and lacking in his explanation. But unless you make the commitment to return to the Church and attend regularly (and raise your daughter to do the same), there is no point in trying to ask any priest anywhere to baptise her.
1 person likes this
@candygurl24 (1880)
• Canada
26 Jan 07
I have to totally disagree with you. Just because I don't attend church on a regular basis doesn't mean that I don't pray. I just don't believe most of the teachings or should I say rantings of the Catholic church. As for having her baptized, another Catholic church is more than willing to do it as is the Anglican church. And the so called priest of that horrible church is also not God, he cannot choose whom he will baptize and whom he will not. He follows God's will, and God says that all are welcome in his home. As for age, she is 4 years old, she wants to go to Sunday school with her sister and she wants to partake in the Religious studies program at her preschool which is the same school that my eldest daughter attends. My eldest also attends the Religious studies program at her school. It is a Catholic school, and if my children want to follow that faith then so be it. I do not influence them either way. As for my attending regularly, I couldn't even if I wanted to seeing as how I live in a different province, and there is no RC church here. Only an Anglican which I will indeed be attending after we re baptize our family there. Catholics can stick everything right up there as* as far as I'm concerned. They think that there is only one way to do everything, and that is that. God did not tell us to be robots, he gave us personalities for a reason. I have also stated before that the CATHOLIC church baptized my eldest daughter, and I did not attend church at any point in time at that time, but it was done because God loves all children, and that NO ONE except God can judge us. So thanks for your single minded opinion, but I'll pass.
@kiwimac (323)
• New Zealand
26 Jan 07
Chuck,
I disagree. The problem here is a priest being unwilling to acknowledge that baptism is not about HIM, it is about the child and its family.
Paedo-Baptism is an acknowledgement of the Grace of God operative in the life of the smallest, weakest, most powerless of human-lives.
Jesus did not says, "let the little children whose parents intend to raise them as Jews come to me.' No, he said " Let all the children come to me." It is God who decides not the church.
Ray McIntyre
Priest
Anglican Church International
1 person likes this
