How hard is it...really
@DanielMarvoloRiddle (331)
United States
February 7, 2007 10:43am CST
At the risk of sounding like the intellectual snob I am often accused of being, I have a very simple question for my MyLot community...
Considering that you are putting your thoughts out for all the world to see, would it be so difficult to check your grammar and use a freakin' spell check?
And while I'm at it, does it take that much longer to spell out the word "see" instead of just typing a silly C? These sorts of virtual shorthand should be punishable by some sort of dastardly method. I'm thinking Chinese water torture would be a good place to start for the most egregious offenders.
I recall nearly ten years ago reading an article in the New Yorker where two people were going point/counterpoint on whether email and instant messaging were good or bad for improving literacy. You would think that just by the simple exposure to writing more often, people would improve, but that hope seems to be optimistic to the point of foolishness. The dissenting voice argued rather eloquently that the sort of instant gratification email provided lessened the standards of communication, failed to encourage thoughtfulness, and probably caused more damage to literacy than facilitate growth. Ten years later that situation isn't any better. Just read some of the replies for evidence.
And while I'm at it...
Why do people feel the need to respond do a discussion with something so terribly frivolous that adds nothing to the intellectual environment of the discussion? If you have nothing cogent, lucid, encouraging, or even conscientiously dissenting to say, is the 3 cents or whatever really worth it? Wouldn't discretion be the better part of valor?
Oh, now I know what the guilty will argue. "Well, (and I've grown to HATE that word!)I could use one of those fancy semicolons if I wanted, but I don't have time to worry about that."
*Insert prodigious eye rolling here*
I ask very little here, people. Actually type a coherent sentence--or live a little and type two, and try to use proper grammar while you're at it. And so long as you're at it, have something to say.
In the immortal words of Steve Martin from Planes, Trains and Automobiles..."When you tell a story, have a point--it's so much more entertaining for the listener."
16 people like this
37 responses
@Lindalinda (4111)
• Canada
7 Feb 07
1. check out the Mylot population (users by location) and you will see that many many people come to this forum who speak English as a second language. I think this is really exiting to have participants from all over the world, but we have to be tolerant.
2. Where is the freaking Spellcheck?I have not found it yet in Mylot. Should I type my answers in Word, use the Spellcheck and copy and paste into Mylot? Help me out here I am challenged.
3.Text messaging jargon is my pet peeve too. I always comment to people who use it in this forum. You should not be"u" etc. etc. etc. It should be added to the Mylot rules.
4. Useless answers don"t bother me anymore, because if someone needs the three cents, who am I to begrudge it.
5. This is not an intellectual forum. Some of the participants are very young, are from another different world, do not always understand English very well, some hope to improve their English and so on.
6. Always remember the diversity of this forum and pick and choose what interests you and ignore the rest, no one forces you to read posts that contain bad grammar, no punctuation, spelling errors and textmessaging jargon.
@Lindalinda (4111)
• Canada
8 Feb 07
I don't have Firefox, that explains why I cannot find a Spellcheck.
Sorry, I overlooked that. Yes, of course you have to read posts with bad grammar etc. if you want to know what people have to say. Touché
@DanielMarvoloRiddle (331)
• United States
8 Feb 07
1. Those people are free from my scorn.
2. The latest version of Firefox has spellcheck.
3. We're in perfect agreement here.
4. The three cents doesn't bother me. The uselessness does.
5. If someone is trying to improve their English, more power to them?
6. I'm forced to read posts with bad grammar, no punctuation, spelling errors and textmessaging jargon when they reply to my posts and within my interests.
1 person likes this
@geekwidow (88)
• United States
8 Feb 07
About the spell check thing, there are many users (like me) who cannot download firefox for one reason or another. My reason happens to be that I access this site from work and can't do any downloading on this computer. If there were a spell check on mylot itself, trust me I would use it! All the other stuff I am with you on though.
@emeraldisle (13139)
• United States
7 Feb 07
I can handle the typos, the poorly constructed sentences, and even some words misspelled. We are all human and do make mistakes on occassion. What I have a big problem with is the text speak used in written form, the lack of punctuation at all, and my ever favorite all capitals or all lower case letters. There is no reason to use text speak in here or in emails for that matter. You want people to be able to read what you are writing; to be able to understand it. So instead of typing like "c", "u" or "r" put in see, you, or are. There are many other examples but those three come right to mind. Please learn to use punctuation. I'm not worried so much about the semi-colons or colons. I'm talking about using a period at the end of a sentence or an apostrophe when using a contraction. Just the basics so that we can understand what the words are and when a sentence begins and ends. Which brings be to capitalization. Learn how to use the shift key. Do not put everything in capital letters or all lower case, it makes it hard to read. It can also make it look like you are yelling. Yes do a word in all capitals to highlight it or to make a point but not all of them. The rest of the errors, mistakes, typing in a hurry I can deal with just not those minor things.
3 people like this
@DanielMarvoloRiddle (331)
• United States
7 Feb 07
You're such a kinder and gentler soul than I...
3 people like this
@elisata (568)
• Netherlands
7 Feb 07
I do SO agree with you!!! English is not my native language (I am Dutch) and I hardly understand all these abreviations (or maybe double b???) and typo's that aren't typo's anymore... And I don't want to understand them!! I mean, an intelligent discussion needs an intelligent answer. The excuse of typing 'fast' is not a real excuse, because obviously people don't read what they have typed at all. I wonder if they understand themselves... LOL... I am all for the old fashioned 'perfect' English, as much as is humanly possible. The reasoning that most members are Americans and that school doesn't teach proper English anymore, is only half an excuse, because if people would really find it important, they would take much more care...
BTW all that fast typing for what? one dollarcent extra or something? Argghhhhhh!!
3 people like this
@Gigglygrrl (362)
• United States
8 Feb 07
I taught at a university in the last few years and you would be surprised at how much "text speak" ends up in real papers. I was FLOORED. The uni I was teaching at is considered one of the best, a "Public Ivy" and probably
15-20K a year to attend. Currently my third graders know the difference between "there, their, and they're" and many my of my college folks didn't.
Now this isn't to say all of my students were this way, but enough that it made me scared for the future.
2 people like this
@DanielMarvoloRiddle (331)
• United States
8 Feb 07
Actually, being a former Adjunct English Professor--I would believe it. Even though it was expressly stated that such jargon was a punishable offense. I really don't think they know any better. But it isn't because people like ourselves didn't try.
1 person likes this
@renestl (99)
• United States
8 Feb 07
I find it appalling that any college student would use text talk in a paper. I have just graduated from college myself and I know it is much easier to use the shorthand version of words. I also know how to switch instantly from text talk to correct English if needed. I would never, ever think to turn in a paper with any shorthand in it. Even though schools have gone downhill, I would never use them as an excuse because I know that you can rise above your education if you really want.
@renestl (99)
• United States
8 Feb 07
I find it appalling that any college student would use text talk in a paper. I have just graduated from college myself and I know it is much easier to use the shorthand version of words. I also know how to switch instantly from text talk to correct English if needed. I would never, ever think to turn in a paper with any shorthand in it. Even though schools have gone downhill, I would never use them as an excuse because I know that you can rise above your education if you really want.
@unusualsuspect (2602)
• United States
7 Feb 07
Quit banging your head against the wall. The war was lost a long time ago. Illiteracy is growing at a healthy clip, and a good number of the people you're trying to address couldn't use a spell check if their lives depended on it. Many are also from foreign countries and are struggling to express themselves in English. Granted, some will never learn, but others are trying.
And the bottom line here, for too many, is money, money, money. Answer with a word or two, relevant or not, get your point, and hurry to the next discussion.
3 people like this
@DanielMarvoloRiddle (331)
• United States
7 Feb 07
I know, I know. But we mustn't give up the good fight! And for the people whose native language is not English, I forgive them, and I bless them for learning another language. But for our people here...GRAH!
4 people like this
@HamBandit (66)
• United States
7 Feb 07
I agree wholeheartedly with you. It's a shame that peoples' education concerning grammar has been tossed out the window. I understand that not everyone has the time to stroke out "see" instead of "c"; fractions of seconds are so sacred and few--why waste them with cumbersome, correct grammar!? It's really unappealing to see people type in such a manner.
Download Firefox 2.0--it has spellcheck installed in it.
3 people like this
@aspendreamer (257)
• United States
8 Feb 07
I totally agree with you 100%...
And I loved Steve Martin when he said that wonderful line...
However, I have asked this question in Yahoo Answers and the responses I got varied from: the people were in a rush, they didn't know how to spell certain words and the spell checker didn't offer help...
They claim it's all for the points anyway and working your way up the proverbial ladder in the community...
Some said, that because it is a world wide site and people of all nations answer these questions, that has a lot to do with how they express themselves or spell or even answer in a way we might either understand or not...
I suppose broken English is supposed to be better than none...
But my retort is, if I were on an international site that required my use of some language other than English, I would be in trouble, because I wouldn't be able to spell or write in a different language, so I would have to pass it all by...
So I feel if a web site asks for you to use English to participate you should do just that!!!
Type your answer so your reader can read it and not have to try to make out what in the world you said...
Leave the texting to your phones and those that already understand your way...
Type correctly in a public place...
@mom2chriskel (1060)
• United States
8 Feb 07
I hate "text" talk. I'm one of those ones who has to spell the whole word out. I won't say my grammar is perfect or even my spelling. But I do try to make sentences. Of course, even if I did text with my cell, I would still spell the whole word out because it would bug me to see it typed that way.
My husband has terrible spelling but if he has to type or write something to someone he will ask me to proof read it for the basics.
I do wish that people would type whole words out but what can you do?
@greengal (4286)
• United States
8 Feb 07
I couldn't agree with you more. I use short, out of the blue abbreviations too, but definitely not here. That is totally confined to people who understand that language and also while chatting where it is acceptable. I've received many responses too which have too many, should I say, downsized text in them! I think Chinese torture it is, for the offenders! I must tell you, I felt very good reading your discussion, it has a good use of vocabulary and I've always wanted to write like that..hmm,well maybe someday! :)
2 people like this
@vanities (11395)
• Davao, Philippines
8 Feb 07
well thats a very good observation here in my lot, but unluckily some members of my lot cant really write straight english nor spell the correct words...but my lot admin welcomes them and tolerated them as long as the readers can understand it..have patience my dear not all here are well verse on engish language...maybe its one of main causes why some discussions from other sites are being copy pasted by some members here lol...
1 person likes this
@aspendreamer (257)
• United States
8 Feb 07
Those of us under 500 points cannot copy and paste, so I think that wont work here...
@Tetchie (2932)
• Australia
8 Feb 07
I'm on your side with this one. I used to edit and transcribe so it was important to be able to spell and use proper grammar etc.
Bear in mind though the differences between English and American spelling, Australia has adopted the English and so use S more than Z in words such as realise or realize, and include the U in words like favour or favor, colour or color etc.
I wanted to put that in the argument in case the grammar judges are not aware.
But there would be an argument for shear laziness versus those who think it is not important, to those who believe because they have soooooo much to do details don't matter.
This seems to be the price of a speeding up. Lack of time as stated by teachers who say they are not able to do justice to English. It invokes unreasonable deadlines as a reason. But once changes (in this case our language) become acceptable and common place in a society then the damage is done and is difficult to undo.
So are we experiencing the last frontier of the English language as we know it? Alas!
2 people like this
@DanielMarvoloRiddle (331)
• United States
8 Feb 07
The rudimentary differences between English/American English don't bother me at all. Having read Anglo Saxon/Middle English/ etc., I've studied the evolution of the language enough for that not to be any big deal.
Teachers get a raw deal. I happened to teach at a school where grammar was beaten into kids' heads, but in a lot of schools, that isn't true because they are so concerned with standardized testing that they don't make it a priority.
As long as there are people like us, the language won't totally devolve, and there is some comfort to be taken in that.
2 people like this
@RobinJ (2501)
• Canada
8 Feb 07
I completely agree. As for proper grammar, sorry mine is not that good. I agree with the spell check, and I have one installed on my tool bar. I wasn't aware that this could be done until, I joined mylot and didn"t find a spell check. So I went on to Yahoo answers and found out how to down load a spell check program. Because I am probably the worlds worst speller. and I do mot IM , as I do not own a cell phone.
2 people like this
@michelledarcy (5220)
•
8 Feb 07
I the reason why people don't check their spelling and grammar is because they don't know its wrong. I have been spelling several words wrong for a long time and its only until recently when a friend pointed it out to me that I realised I was doing it.
Text speak does irritate me though, if people can't be bothered to write the words out in full, I can't be bothered to give them a positive rating.
1 person likes this
@frankman (7)
• United States
8 Feb 07
I have to agree. I was just reading another thread and reading a reply from a teacher. I can't tell you how shocked I was to see how poorly she constructed even the most basic sentence. That and she misspelled a handful of words. It was like reading the ramblings of a 4th grader. I was embarrassed for them.
2 people like this
@abhiquest (579)
• India
8 Feb 07
I think spell checker could really boost the earning potential, and it won't take much of a time for members too. I think it should be there.
1 person likes this
@cjthedog64 (1552)
• United States
8 Feb 07
For the most part, I agree with you. I hate when people try to do something in writing and they can't make a simple point or get the basics of spelling or grammar down. That's why I avoid places that use chat or texting spellings. It's amazing that people even know how to spell anymore because of all the shortcuts that are becoming en vogue.
On the other hand, this site has a lot of non native English speakers & writers. It's usually obvious to me when they're typing, and I try to overlook the errors. But if someone's writing from Iowa or someplace similar, I'd expect the basics of English. I think it makes English speakers look bad to the rest of the world when they can't do the basics.
1 person likes this
@staindrain (25)
• India
8 Feb 07
Hi, first I would like to say that you are extremely articulate and a good writer.
I also agree that people should use proper grammar while typing their electronic messages (you know what I mean by this), but this net lingo has actually come from the contraints of character count that most service providers thrust upon the users, like for instance mobile phones generated sms, hence in such a scenario it becomes extremely beneficial for a user to use the frivolous net lingo, as it is popularily known as.Also, people having less typing speed can synchronize a chat session with friends using lesser characters and still conveying the message over the internet...
And then of course using a colon and a bracket :) in the last 2 characters left can actually convey your mood to the recipient, which is so very helpful in communications not controlled by eye contacts, as such they are quite emotionless, as the person receiving them can ONLY read, that's all!
At last, I agree that we have no right to play with a language's identity and hence it's correctness must be ensured as far as possible.
@xfallenxlostx (2074)
• United States
8 Feb 07
1 2 mothereffing 3. That means i agree with you completely. People need to learn to effing use grammar and check their affing spelling. Yes, sometimes you make a typo, and that is understandable. However, most of the time, it is just plain ignorance. Really, people...is it that hard?
